Michigan vs. FSU, Orange Bowl, 8pm, ESPN, Game Day - Post Game Discussion

[THE_WIZARD_]

Thanks hack. Love you too bro.

[AlabamAlum]

No, Talent. M plays the wrong offense and while they have a good D, their strength is in the secondary. We'd be content to pound it down their collective throats. It would be an ugly game.

[AlabamAlum]

and, lol, at M not being a protected flagship.

[hack]

It is that -- take a look at the venn diagram. Which is a good hasty rebuttal to talent's hasty objection. In the last 2 years of the study sample Michigan was in that category despite being a .500 team for the duration. I'm not saying this study proves anything specific about The Game 2016, but it's something relevant and interesting. I recognize that in saying the refs are incompetent and not conspiratorial, that the expected internet-forum reaction to that will be that I'll be called conspiracy theorist. That's how it goes. But for those who want to look, there's an interesting data point. I've long suspected that big data would tell us things about sports reffing, and if there are more studies, methodologies will probably improve even further. Hope that happens.

[AlabamAlum]

Hack,

It's not my thing, man.

The study of something so completely and utterly subjective makes the data points, whatever they may be, pretty unreliable. And when I say "pretty" I really mean completely.

So, teams who are very good and likely to go to the playoff often don't commit as many judgment-based penalties? Okay. By 10%? Losing me...

I will give you a stat. The Alabama front seven is the best front 7 in college football. In my opinion, not only this year, but all time. They are shockingly effective. We have played 12 teams and overwhelmed every offensive line we have faced. Rival offenses have over 700 snaps against this defense and these overwhelmed o-lines we have faced have only been called for holding a grand total of....wait for it....twice. The first holding call wasn't until game 9. As a protected flagship, I want my money back.

[hack]

Holding has hardly been called on M's opposing OLs too.

You can throw it out completely if you wish to, or take a look at what's useful, but hey -- at least get straight what it is and how it classifies a team. I get that it's easier and faster to take a dump on something rather than to take a bit to understand it. It's a sports forum. Either way, it's interesting to put out there, and I'm not gonna bitch and moan about how everybody needs to give me more time to clarify my point.

IMO the data I'd really like to see is ref-by-ref. If I asked every NBA player whether charting foul calls by ref and player would be useful, we all know what they would say. As is often said, refs are human.

[AlabamAlum]

Hack,

You are relentless. Heh. I don't agree with you on most of this as it relates to M-OSU, but I like the bulldog perseverance.

[froot loops]

I think any MSU fan would tell you that was the weakest MSU team of those 3 years, and any MSU fan would gladly take a replay of that game even if it meant a 45-0 loss. Sitting on the sidelines because you may get a bare bottom spanking is the height of foolishness. If Cook doesn't get picked at the end of the half there maybe it's a different game they still lose.

Any Michigan fan should be manly enough to take the chance to get in even if you personally think Bama will run roughshod over you. Is this even really a dilemma? Root for any scenario to allow you to back in, you never know.

[hack]

Well that depends. Are you doing Wiz math, where we talk about 10 50/50 calls and I say I'm happy with just getting one or two going my way on the road if not three, and he comes back with ``so you're just bitching about the one call, then''? If you do Wiz math (as opposed to being a math wiz) you definitely should disagree with me. But then you would have to ask yourself why you want to do anything like Wiz does.

True, though, about me. You'll see it my way eventually. So will Talent, which is why he is so shrill lately.

[hack]

I think any MSU fan would tell you that was the weakest MSU team of those 3 years, and any MSU fan would gladly take a replay of that game even if it meant a 45-0 loss. Sitting on the sidelines because you may get a bare bottom spanking is the height of foolishness. If Cook doesn't get picked at the end of the half there maybe it's a different game they still lose.

Any Michigan fan should be manly enough to take the chance to get in even if you personally think Bama will run roughshod over you. Is this even really a dilemma? Root for any scenario to allow you to back in, you never know.

As for that specific part of the debate, yeah -- agreed. We should want to be in the playoff, because one never knows. At least, that would be my position. I don't expect the committee to completely see it my way, but as far as I'm concerned the only team that really belongs in there ahead of Michigan is Washington, assuming they win. I don't think any ACC team is worthy.

[AlabamAlum]

Well that depends. Are you doing Wiz math, where we talk about 10 50/50 calls and I say I'm happy with just getting one or two going my way on the road if not three, and he comes back with ``so you're just bitching about the one call, then''? If you do Wiz math (as opposed to being a math wiz) you definitely should disagree with me. But then you would have to ask yourself why you want to do anything like Wiz does.

True, though, about me. You'll see it my way eventually. So will Talent, which is why he is so shrill lately.

I don't agree that the officiating was bad in the OSU-M game. I think it was fairly called other than a blown PI. But you won't convert me. In fact, I am sick to tears of the talk of it.

[hack]

Well I think in truth for me the only thing left is that I'm genuinely curious about whether the conference has a formal policy or not on conflicts of interest. The game is over, and if you watched the youtube montage WingsFan posted and weren't convinced there were 6-10 50/50 calls and not one went Michigan's way, then fair enough. Nobody changes their mind on a sports forum anyways.

But it would be interesting to know about the conflict-of-interest policy for the future. The ability of any conference to respond to such a controversy with something like ``we have a policy, we followed it, and you can read the policy on our web site'' would be great. That immediately shuts down the more-stupid parts of the debate, and if that happens then the only losers are the bottom-feeder types of media. What's interesting to me at this point is the resistance to the idea that you can focus these things away from the refs through the consistent application of fair policy. There shouldn't be any resistance at all to that.

[iam416]

I don't agree that the officiating was bad in the OSU-M game. I think it was fairly called other than a blown PI. But you won't convert me. In fact, I am sick to tears of the talk of it.

Correct on all counts.

[THE_WIZARD_]

Ditto

[Wellington_beefhouser]

I get the very weird feeling talent and aa are the same person. Wiz is his little brother.