UM Football Recruiting - by WM Wolverine

[Ghengis Jon]

Do you put your NFL hopes in the hands of an untested group of coaches with a pile of impressive credentials or do you rely on recent successes, on winning records, year in and year out?

Like I said, I have serious doubts that M's recruiting trajectory will change substantially until Harbaugh proves he can develop players, win games and put M back into the national CFB discussion.

My view is that's a couple of years away.

I think you underestimate the shallowness of today's 'twitter' mentality. Its all short attention span theater. If UM really rocks this year, say 10-2 entering the bowl season, I think we see top 10 recruiting class again immediately. Star power coaching, good w/l record, national exposure, all at a top flight university is a mixture for instant success. Especially at a place like UM.

Kids don't remember when UM was consistantly very good. They have no long term memory. One or two good seasons will erase the last 7. I think its a reflection of today's society where its all about the here and now, no one gives a hoot about history, the long term, or consistancy going forward. Its like the whole sports world has ADD.

[iam416]

Kids don't remember when UM was consistantly very good. They have no long term memory

Well, to be fair, you'd pretty much need to be collecting social security to remember that, so memory isn't really the problem :-)

Michigan still has all the bells and whistles of a winning program, and that's what draws kids. I mean, I hate to go back to this, but Hoke recruited really well -- perhaps a bit uneven positionally -- but really well. I mean, Franklin is recruiting really well at Penn State. Out of the gate. Because it's Penn State. JH will do really well -- maybe not quite as well as the few who had 5* kid crawling to AA to play for him, but really well.

However, you can't put the MSU cat back in the bag. They've built up a lot of credibility as a legitimate program. They're not going away until they start going 7-5 routinely and playing in front of 50,000 people.

[hack]

I think you underestimate the shallowness of today's 'twitter' mentality. Its all short attention span theater. If UM really rocks this year, say 10-2 entering the bowl season, I think we see top 10 recruiting class again immediately. Star power coaching, good w/l record, national exposure, all at a top flight university is a mixture for instant success. Especially at a place like UM.

Kids don't remember when UM was consistantly very good. They have no long term memory. One or two good seasons will erase the last 7. I think its a reflection of today's society where its all about the here and now, no one gives a hoot about history, the long term, or consistancy going forward. Its like the whole sports world has ADD.

Overall fair enough but this particular take might be a little extreme. You hear all the time from kids ``This is still Michigan''. I'm sure some of them do know their history, and they coaches and other older mentors talking to them.

[WM Wolverine]

Sparty is building something and their recruiting is trending up but IF and when M is the best program in the state (probably not this season yet), M will land most every recruit in-state they want...

If and when M is back, Sparty will get M's, Ohio's and PSU's leftovers which is what Dantonio build a program that consistently wins 11+ games a season with.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Jon, don't go all extreme on me here to make your point ..... which, BTW, is valid.

Anyone watching college football and actively interested in it, no matter what the age, knows where M is right now. The toilet. The Harbaugh hire may have got swimmers to the rim but nothing changes until M starts winning, developing NFL caliber players and getting some of them into the early draft rounds. Like I said in my original post, that's few years off.

You have to be an idiot to write off Dantonio/MSU. They are a Big Ten power now, like M used to be. M is Minnesota and maybe a shade more toward Indiana and Purdue ..... until Harbaugh can demonstrate otherwise.

osu is this season's National Champ until someone knocks them off. That Championship is no fluke. It is the result of a commitment by the U administration and the football program to be #1 which has existed and been perpetuated since Woody. The Ten Year War is the one period (in the modern age of football) where M challenged osu's ascendency; the other is the period during which LC managed to go 12-1, or whatever it was, against them and even then, osu was still a very good football team.

Since then, M has sucked. That's a decade of suck. So, yeah, things MIGHT turn around under Harbaugh. They SHOULD turnaround given his track record but until I actually see that happening (and it starts with wins against Utah and BYU ..... convincing wins), I'm not buying into anything that is characterized as a trun around by football pundits.

Frankly, and despite the Twitter world phenomenon you point to Jon, unless Harbaugh produces some kind of amazing season in 2015 ..... like getting to the final 4, kids, the difference makers, aren't going to be drawn to AA, the U or M football when they have offers from the rest who actually have proven they can CONSISTENTLY play big boy football on the national stage.

[hack]

osu is this season's National Champ until someone knocks them off. That Championship is no fluke. It is the result of a commitment by the U administration and the football program to be #1 which has existed and been perpetuated since Woody. The Ten Year War is the one period (in the modern age of football) where M challenged osu's ascendency; the other is the period during which LC managed to go 12-1, or whatever it was, against them and even then, osu was still a very good football team.

So, basically, despite OSU making it a top priority and always cheating, and Michigan coming up on thirty years of serious ambivalence and never cheating, Michigan still managed to put those craven punks in their place until it lost its way and hired two shit coaches? And now we have one of the best coaches on the planet?

SOUNDS GOOD TO ME!

[Da Geezer]

Amen Hack.

No need to be redundant because Talent (hereafter named "Fifi") and I got into the systematic OSU cheating starting at about post 710 of the Team 136 thread. The tentacle I focused on was Fork Union Military Academy. That is one place where OSU sends its non-qualifiers. I think there is an IMG Academy in the south that the SEC uses.

The scam is that these institutions are High Schools where non-qualifiers go to "raise their gradepoint". These High Schools also offer AP courses, which, translated, means college credit at some of the less rigorous academic institutions. So when Fifi says that OSU has the same admission criteria as UM for football, and doesn't take JUCO players, that is technically correct. But is "lawyered up bullshit", to pick a phrase, in that OSU has a farm system. That is how Cordell Jones got to be 23.

The relevance here is that MSU has started to do the same thing. State hired Tressel, and Meyer lets Dantonio have the players Meyer doesn't want. How many real OSU/MSU head-to-head competitions have you read about in the last year? So the two schools in the B10 that are always saying "we are just as good academically as our peers" are in fact legally gaming the system.

Also, in related news, CNN is reporting on a lawsuit filed by UNC athletes from the last 20 years or so, seeking damages for not giving them an education in exchange for the plaintiffs playing basketball/football. The NCAA filed a response brief saying that the NCAA does not guaranty an education. It seems that all the "student first, athlete second" theme is just PR. The NCAA couldn't care less if guys like Greg Oden don't know within 1,000 miles where Portland OR is.

As I said on the other thread, MSU and OSU are really the SEC North. And we should watch Franklin.

[hack]

We're gonna beat their cheating asses anyways. They can cheat and lose; I don't care.

[Prime2]

We're gonna beat their cheating asses anyways. They can cheat and lose; I don't care.

Without question, a coach doesn't take the 49ers who hadn't made the playoffs in 9 consecutive years to the NFC title game in his first year because he is lucky.

My friends, Harbaugh is likely a coaching genius, relax and enjoy one hell of a ride.

[froot loops]

Amen Hack.

No need to be redundant because Talent (hereafter named "Fifi") and I got into the systematic OSU cheating starting at about post 710 of the Team 136 thread. The tentacle I focused on was Fork Union Military Academy. That is one place where OSU sends its non-qualifiers. I think there is an IMG Academy in the south that the SEC uses.

The scam is that these institutions are High Schools where non-qualifiers go to "raise their gradepoint". These High Schools also offer AP courses, which, translated, means college credit at some of the less rigorous academic institutions. So when Fifi says that OSU has the same admission criteria as UM for football, and doesn't take JUCO players, that is technically correct. But is "lawyered up bullshit", to pick a phrase, in that OSU has a farm system. That is how Cordell Jones got to be 23.

The relevance here is that MSU has started to do the same thing. State hired Tressel, and Meyer lets Dantonio have the players Meyer doesn't want. How many real OSU/MSU head-to-head competitions have you read about in the last year? So the two schools in the B10 that are always saying "we are just as good academically as our peers" are in fact legally gaming the system.

Also, in related news, CNN is reporting on a lawsuit filed by UNC athletes from the last 20 years or so, seeking damages for not giving them an education in exchange for the plaintiffs playing basketball/football. The NCAA filed a response brief saying that the NCAA does not guaranty an education. It seems that all the "student first, athlete second" theme is just PR. The NCAA couldn't care less if guys like Greg Oden don't know within 1,000 miles where Portland OR is.

As I said on the other thread, MSU and OSU are really the SEC North. And we should watch Franklin.

Name the players that MSU is doing this with.

[iam416]

LMAO @ IMG. So fucking clueless.

And @ FUMA (Chris Perry) and the kids who go there. And Caardale's age. Just LOL.

And triple LMAO at people on this thread hoping JH would bring in some JUCOs (which he couldn't manage to do).

I can't believe I actually took Geezer seriously. I mean, fucking hell...textbook ignorance and outright stupidity that would make any M man proud. That had to be a late April Fool's joke.

[iam416]

The upside, of course, is that I enjoy these predictions. I'll have to unblock Prime2 and, now, Geezer, to go back and read them. But feeding you bitches shit sandwiches is a good time.

[iam416]

Frankly, and despite the Twitter world phenomenon you point to Jon, unless Harbaugh produces some kind of amazing season in 2015 ..... like getting to the final 4, kids, the difference makers, aren't going to be drawn to AA, the U or M football when they have offers from the rest who actually have proven they can CONSISTENTLY play big boy football on the national stage.

I still say you underestimate this, Buchanan. I think JH will do fine recruiting for 2015 and even better in 2016.

Oh, and Carr had a losing record against OSU. But Coop managed to go 2-10-1, not 1-12. It's a small difference, but I hate to get robbed of that extra win. M, btw, is creeping up on 1-12. Better get that win in AA this year.

[froot loops]

Yeah when Da Geezer is talking about Meyer and Dantonio working in tandem, it is a tell that he doesn't know what he's taking about. Meyer and Dantonio do not get along.

[iam416]

Obvious flame. No one is that stupid and ignorant. Just no value in reading him any more. OP, Jr.