UM Football Recruiting - by WM Wolverine

[The Oracle]

And nothing I saw on him was overly optimistic.

[WM Wolverine]

Agree with Oracle, he's a longshot for now; likely to stay in the south.

[ahoda]

I forget who Sam Webb was talking about on the radio yesterday but some big name player was in town this past weekend and reportedly really liked it. I think he brought both of his parents too and they were impressed.

Sorry that I don't recall the name but I think it was a 2013 kid.

It was a 2014 kid and it was a stud DT from Utah named Bryan Mone. He was close to comitting. Also 2014 CB Parker Westphal was in town over the weekend and he's pretty much all Blue.

[ahoda]

Agree with Oracle, he's a longshot for now; likely to stay in the south.

McQuay is USC's player to lose right now. Don't count out UofM yet because his parents loved the visit and the music program is one of the best in the nation. Vandy is the other team in his top 3.

[lineygoblue]

The feeling I get from reading the info at Rivals is that the Treadwell ship is about to sail, and Michigan is not the destination.

With Derrick Green, the ship is at the dock, and Green is preparing to board. Michigan's chances are probably about 1/3 or less.

I get the feeling that the determining factors in both cases are about the availability of "green" at other destinations, and unavailability of "green" at Michigan.

Hoke will not risk NCAA sanctions just to sign a kid. We better get used to losing out on the "top" recruits who have an eye on money. We won't be getting them when money is the determining factor.

[hack]

Well, look -- if the real problem with the inability to land 5* skill players is cash, then I'd rather it be that problem than any other problem.

[lineygoblue]

I agree, Hack.

I don't want Michigan serving sanctions because they had to get some booster to pay "Johnny Rocketspeed" to sign with Michigan.

I'd rather see other teams serve those sanctions.

My point is, I don't think we're going to see Michigan get those Top 25 (regardless of position) players without greasing the rails with some cash.

That's what it takes nowadays, and Hoke will never do it.

[hack]

Has the game really changed that much from the time when Carr was getting them? Cash is now a certainty and a regular thing?

[Rocky Bleier]

Can't we at least match whatever osu is offering to their recruits? Hate to hand them the BIG over some money.

[Mike]

Has the game really changed that much from the time when Carr was getting them? Cash is now a certainty and a regular thing?

This is a good question. With regard to the first part, yes, I think the game has changed exponentially over the last 5-10 years largely due to the BCS and the explosion of coaches salaries. If a coach is making $3-$5 million a year at an institution that doesn't mind playing in the gray areas of the rules and there is incredible pressure to make BCS bowls and championship games, than you'll see efficiently run payola machines pop up at those schools. Consider it the cost of doing business - a barrier to entry of sorts - if you want to regularly compete for national championships.

Boosters paying players is certainly nothing new but I think the difference now is you either cheat or play in Gator Bowls. I honestly don't think a squeaky clean program will win a BCS title for a looooong time. In fact, there is a direct correlation and causal relationship between the dirtiest programs in the country and on-field success. Take a quick look at the best teams over the past decade. Of the top of my head: Bama, Oregon, USC, ohio, Oklahoma. Bastions of integrity? Hardly. In the 80s and 90s we had Miami, OU, and Florida State. Any difference? No.

NOTHING will change until the punishment doled out by the NCAA out-weighs the positives gained by cheating. Currently, a clean program trying to win the BCS is like a clean cyclist trying to beat Lance Armstrong in the Tour de France.

There's really only 3 possible outcomes: 1. Get on board with cheating, accept it, thrive at it. 2. The NCAA cleans house and levels the playing field. This will happen as soon as I fly Scarlett Johansson to Mars for our first date. 3. Go to the Gator Bowl.

The problem for Michigan is they aren't getting down in the muck anytime soon and even if they did I'm certain they would screw it up. It's just not in their nature. It would be like the software engineers from Office Space looking up money laundering in the dictionary.

To the second part of your question... Have you heard of Cam Newton?

[hack]

Give Scarlett a pat on the ass for me. The Red Planet is a good venue for a girl that looks great in red.

LOL @ the Office Space reference. You're right. Michigan wouldn't be good at it. If it's really that bad, well, sigh. Make Mattison hang out with Kobe Bryant in that hyperbaric chamber so we can keep him on the sidelines for another 20 years, cause that would be the only hope.

Just for the sake of argument, 'cause I'm not a baseball guy and don't really know, but this is what was said about that sport. That they moneyed teams (Yankees and maybe no one else) were gonna dominate. They haven't, necessarily. Do lessons there apply to CFB?

[BlueInFlorida]

When I was a kid in the 50's, I remember my Dad saying that a lot of college players didn't want to turn pro because they couldn't afford the pay cut.

This stuff has been going on a long time. And now there is too much money involved at all levels to really crack down on all the big time programs possibly (or probably) involved.

[Mike]

That they moneyed teams (Yankees and maybe no one else) were gonna dominate. They haven't, necessarily. Do lessons there apply to CFB?

Depends on your definition of "dominate". Since 1996 the Yankees have won 5 World Series, been to another 2 or 3, and have made the playoffs every year but once which in baseball is unheard of. The Tigers have been to the playoffs 3 times in that span. Obviously, you need to spend the money wisely like Auburn did. The NHL's NY Rangers used to always be at or near the top of the payroll scale and didn't even make the playoffs. You can't simply spend your way to greatness as the Yankees are proving the last few years. Still, that they are considered a trainwreck after leading the AL with 96 wins and making the ALCS should tell you about the level of excellence to which they have grown accustomed.

On one hand you have the Oakland A's who have had success with a very small payroll by utilizing saber-metrics. OTOH, you have the 2012 Marlins who thought they could just throw a bunch of money at players and they would suddenly become great. Neither approach gets you a championship because at the end of the day, the A's simply don't have the talent and the Marlins were a collection of individuals. When you combine the money and the math, you get the Boston Red Sox and St. Louis Cardinals.

I would imagine that in CFB, sheer talent can overcome a lot of other weaknesses. It's more about the Jimmys and Joes. If you give Nick Saban and his opponent exactly the same level of talent, Saban will win 60% of the time. Give him greater talent than his opponent and he'll beat them damn near every time.

[lineygoblue]

Excellent post, Mike. I know a lot of that was intended to be tongue in cheek, but a lot of it rings true as well.

I agree that maybe the NCAA should just remove the restrictions. Allow schools to offer jobs to parents, houses, cars, etc. After all, what's wrong with providing someone with a new home, car, or cash to help them thru a difficult time. If their son's talent can bring them a few extra bucks or perks, get him a college education, and a passport to the NFL, what's the problem?

With all the money on the line for the schools, I think something along those lines is going to eventually take place.

[Jeff Buchanan]

So, pretty much like a cold bucket of water hitting the faces of everyone blowing sunshine up each other's butts here, reality has arrived.

Prepare yourselves for a decade of 8-4, an occasional 9-3 and a remote chance at a play-off bowl bid once a decade.

The combination of sucking hind tit on recruiting, the character and culture of Michigan, and accordingly the M football program, and a coaching staff that is what Brandon wanted to continue the Fort Traditions, will make Michigan a good Big Ten Football team. That's about it.