Around the Big Ten

[entropy]

It appears Wilson has not committed to Wisky and took another trip to Auburn.

[Jamie H]

Hmmm. I guess now that $200K Cam is gone, Auburn can spread the wealth a bit.

[lineygoblue]

Unless the player is a preacher's kid. Then he can qualify for the "church building fund grant", that Newton also got ...

[SeanB]

Didn't know where to put this, but the BTN had Lloyd's last game against UF on last night. I only watched the first half, but it was sadly comical to see Bill Martin and Rodriguez standing on the sidelines watching the game. In hindsight, Martin looked rather smug, thinking he had pulled a rabbit out of his ass. Whoops.

I should add that some of the sad comedy stems from the fact that there was a lot of talent on that field, and they all left. Poor Rich was probably thinking he'd have a bit more with which to work!

I DVR'd the game so I could go back and watch the rest...that was a fun game.

[whodean]

It is heartening to know Hoke will have the program back on the national stage soon.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2l5J8EYs9NQ"]YouTube - ‪2008 Capital One Bowl - Michigan vs. Florida [1st Half] [HD]‬‏[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOElNKPDzOE&feature=related"]YouTube - ‪2008 Capital One Bowl - Michigan vs Florida [2nd Half] [HD]‬‏[/ame]

I forgot about that trick tackle eligible pass to Jake Long! Henne blew it but that was funny.

[Hannibal]

Sad that Debord waited until his last game as our offensive coordinator to pull out the stops.

[lineygoblue]

Sad that Carr waited until the final game that year to unleash the full capabilities of that team.

[WM Wolverine]

They weren't healthy the last two games of the regular season...

App St if Mike Hart is healthy, he rushes for 250+ at least, Oregon first half M matched Oregon in yardage in the first half but drives stalled in Oregon's side of the field. Team fell apart (gave up?) in the second half...

In between those four games, M won 8 straight, beating up a lot of mediocre B10 opponents in Llloyd-ball fashion...

That team had a lot of talent, unfortunately there was very little talent behind them. Even some of the talent that was suppose to return, didn't: Manningham, Arrington, Mallett & Boren... Those four could've made '08 'mediocre'; 6-7 wins, that in addition to a healthy Brandon Minor.

[whodean]

Sad that Carr waited until the final game that year to unleash the full capabilities of that team.

I thought for sure after we suffered through 3 years of Rodriguez fucking up his defense by being too aggressive on offense we would all appreciate Lloyd's philosophy just a bit more.

[Jamie H]

I don't think Rodriguez defense would have been good no matter WHAT he did on offense.

[lineygoblue]

I don't think there was anything wrong with Rodriguez's offense. If Robinson had a Noel Devine running alongside him, it would have been unstoppable.

My problem with Rodriguez was his lack of personal attention to the defense. He didn't have the personnel to run a 3-3-5, and that defense is horrible against power running teams.

Nobody on this board respects Lloyd Carr more than I do, but I still feel that there were many times when he held back the explosive parts of his offense (read: passing game) in a Bo-like insistence on establishing the run, even if it meant losing the game.

[whodean]

even if it meant losing the game.

Didn't Lloyd usually win the close ones?

[WM Wolverine]

Lloyd lost a ton of close games vs inferior opponents when he allowed the opposition to stay in the game.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Old subject, rehashed, but what the hell ......

Gary Moeller ended the era of run heavy Michigan offenses by making the tight end an eligible receiver (heh..... more than that but you get the point). He actually had his offenses throwing on first down and third and short to the surprise of the defenses of his opponents. His brand of football was a lot of fun to watch.

I don't think Lloyd was a lot different. Cam Cameron was his first OC (think he flamed out as IU's HC after leaving M) followed by Malone who was very innovative ending up going to the Saints in 2004. Mike Debord was on LC's staff in 94, left for a few years demonstrating his ineptitude as a HC and, after he got fired, got a sympathy re hire as M's OC from LC in 2005, remaining in that position until Lloyd retired.

It's hard to put a finger on when M football became a perennial 3-4 loss season team with seemingly crushing defeats torn from the arms of victory by playing not to lose. But it happened before tressel was hired and his dominance over M football during his tenure at osu and the Rodriguez hire made mediocrity a by-word of M football.

I associate the phenomena of playing not to lose, carried out to extremes, with Mike Debord. Fair or not, that's how I feel. His tenure as M's OC from 2005 - 2007 marked the occurrence of some of the most disappointing losses and seasons for M football than I can remember and of course history is prominently defined by the most recent events.

But he was a terrible OC who seemed unable to have a plan beyond that which he developed for the next week's game. No back-up if a key player went down was my complaint and reliance to a fault on a feature player running a featured play.

Everyone of us can recall the mounting frustration over offensive play calling that, once it was obvious that the defense had figured out what M's offense was going to do, adjusted their defense to stop it, meanwhile, Debord would keep calling the same plays over and over without success. His strategy was to possess the ball, shorten the game, and hope the other team would make a mistake in the closing minutes of the 4th quarter, allowing M to score the winning points.

He did this despite the trend in CFB to the spread, big plays and high scoring offenses which Jim Hermann's defenses repeatedly demonstrated they could get beaten by essentially nullifying the value of a conservative, possess the ball and burn clock strategy on offense. Carr and Debord were sold on the idea that they could set the tempo of the game, force Lloyd Ball, and when they couldn't, advantage went immediately to M's opponent.

There were noteworthy exceptions where Lloyd Ball prevailed and produced wins in big games but I remember more crushing defeats playing Lloyd Ball that eliminated M from BCS contention when it came down to the nut-cutting.

It should be no surprise that M football fans, including myself, were overjoyed with the Rodriguez hire in 2008 and the death of Mike Debord's stultifying offensive play calling. Sadly, that didn't work out, not because Rich didn't install an exciting offense but because he could not field a competent defense capable of beating any of the B10's teams.

I feel pretty good about Brady Hoke but not without some concerns for a return to the Lloyd Ball strategies which characterized m football for two decades. I believe Hoke has the potential of elevating M football above that of the Rodriguez years (not too hard) but not to an elite level that we all want as fans. Where Hoke takes this team will be decided not just by improved defense (something most of us feel is going to happen) but also by what Borges does with the weapons he has on offense.

Lots of talk about using all of these weapons, including both players like DR and the innovative offensive plays that Rodriguez should get credit for, but we've not seen a down of football from Holk yet. I worry about the transition by the OL from the zone blocking techniques of the spread to the man blocking techniques of Hoke's pro-style offense. I worry about a return to Debord's predictability and a failure to optimize the skills that Dennard possesses by over-using him as a drop back, pocket passer.

I never want to see an offense as predictable as M's was in Carr's later years when, IMO, his approach to football was eclipsed by teams who implemented offenses and defenses to take advantage of just the kind of football strategies Lloyd embraced. We're not going to know if there will be a return to an underlying football strategy that characterized M football under LC until well into the 2011 B10 season. I await the elimination of that concern anxiously but not terribly confident.

[Mackenzie]

What I hate to see is for the defensive staff to not make adjustments at half-time or sooner if it is obvious the the opposition offense is having its way. Now I know that is easier said then done and requires talent, execution etc. but I also think it requires the defensive coaching staff to be innovative and flexible rather than stubborn.