Around the Big Ten

[iam416]

It does make me nervous. But what the hell is the Big Ten supposed to do in the middle of the season when a full, LEGIT, investigation hasn't yet taken place? Then there's also the fact that the two biggest games of the conference season are yet to be played and that will settle things on the field. It would set an awful precedent. If I had to wager $5 on the subject of the Big 10 call today (assuming there is one), it would be that the commish is updating the ADs on where things stand and that they need to follow due process, yadi yada...

Well, there's no doubt the Commish is hoping t fucking god M loses @HV. LOL.

But, yeah -- I think he's going to have 12-13 members extremely pissed and pushing for something and 1 member waving the giant middle finger and he's going to be absolutely hosed. If only we had the genius of Kevin Warren to Solomon our way through this.

But, at the end of the day, I just don't see a major penalty coming in 2023 -- never have.

[Mike]

Suspending the HC would effectively torpedo the season. I suppose they could go that route to satisfy the opposing coaches' bloodlust while not making them ineligible for the BTCG but, again, if you're going to do that you'd better have smoking gun evidence obtained through an actual investigation and not just juicy info leaked to eager sports reporters.

[iam416]

FTR, I don't think anything should happen to the M team re eligibility in 2023. If there were penalites re 2021,2022 or if staff were suspended -- alright. But, I'd definitely not touch 2023.

IMO, the punishment ought to be suspension of coaches/staff. No forfeits. No banners taken down. No ineligibility in 2023 (or going forward). That's what I'd do -- and I'd probably wait some.. But, since I have zero opportunity to make that happen we might as well discuss what would happen if Oregon and Washington rematched on Jupiter.

[Mike]

Oregon will beat them by 3 TDs the next time they play. They are far superior to Washington.

[iam416]

Suspending the HC would effectively torpedo the season. I suppose they could go that route to satisfy the opposing coaches' bloodlust while not making them ineligible for the BTCG but, again, if you're going to do that you'd better have smoking gun evidence obtained through an actual investigation and not just juicy info leaked to eager sports reporters.

M is on autopilot. I mean -- it really would depend on whether you also suspended the coordinators, too. But M is so much better than anyone on their schedule that it won't matter. Maybe it matters against Georgia.

[iam416]

Oregon will beat them by 3 TDs the next time they play. They are far superior to Washington.

Yes, but have you considered the playing surface on Jupiter in my hypothetical.

[iam416]

Anyway, I'd still be pretty surprised if anything happens to M in 2023.

[THE_WIZARD_]

Talent...do you think M is a bunch of cheaters?

[Mike]

Speaking of FOX potentially leaning on the Big Ten office, just read this over at the Athletic. The by-line says it all:

The showdown in Ann Arbor will be one of the most anticipated games in the history of the rivalry. There's no shortage of drama to cover

[iam416]

Correct.

[Jeff Buchanan]

But what the hell is the Big Ten supposed to do in the middle of the season when a full, LEGIT, investigation hasn't yet taken place?

This.

I don't think there is any logical reason, other than to inflame with sass, to continue to post conclusions or for sports writers to continue to write conclusions on the matter at hand based on speculation. It would seem smart to me to to instead hold off on posting or reporting until a fact finding body releases a report with, you know, FACTS. FACTS that actually tie JH and/or his coaching staff to involvement with designing and implementing a sign stealing operation that unfairly advantaged the football team.

Stalion was obviously observed doing stuff that there's a good chance was in violation of applicable NCAA rules. He's been seen on the sidelines with M coaches during games. We know that CFB coaches admittedly steal signs. I'll acknowledge that. What we don't know is whether M coaches were directing, and knew in detail, about Stalion's extensive sign stealing operation. Or, instead, were the coaches just taping unknowingly into a resource that seemed to be good at identifying what offensive or defensive play was being called from the opponent's sideline.

I won't endorse the report that Big coaches are pissed off about this and want action against JH when being pissed off is based on what these coaches are reading in the sports press. Reporting that sort of shit does nothing to further an investigation and the discovery of facts in the matter. It's just more piling on in an attempt to control the narrative emerging to discredit JH and M football.

[Dr. Strangelove]

The 2024 Big10 schedule will be out later today, with dates this time.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Bronxblue - the guy that does the post game Best and Worst article at mgo - posted a Best and Worst piece on M's sign stealing brouhaha. It's really long but makes some great points. Some of them support my posts involving a lack of facts supporting the allegations. But that's not all.

The author goes to lengths to take ESPN's Pete Thamel and Yahoo Sports' Ross Dellinger to task for taking unsupported rumors and turning them into a major sports scandal that got all of this started. Bronxblue points out that both journalists or their editors failed to vet anonymous sources or to dig into some obvious dirt, also exposed by these sources, not involving Michigan or the sign stealing accusations. No surprise here. His lead paragraph in the article details why Stalion's sign stealing operation was so incredibly stupid that no CFB coaching staff trying to secretively obtain a future opponents signs would come close to conducting such an operation as Stalion's. Going further the author lays out the likely small contribution that knowing an opponent's signs provides a competitive advantage - just too many other factors at play to make sign stealing an important contributor to stopping an opponent's next play.

Bronxblue also takes M's supporters who believe M principals are not acting proactively to limit the PR damage to task. He argues that M's COA in this situation is to say as little as necessary while making sure that their support of JH and defending him and the U is known. The recent talk of "rescinding" contract talks with JH was quickly addressed as false by people like John U. Bacon - notoriously recognized as a media source frequently employed by the U to get their positions on various issues into the public discourse. IOW, the U supports Jim Harbaugh, is determined to make sure he's not torpedoed and is in the process of getting him signed to a new contract that will make it likely this is Jim's last job. One can conclude from this that M has already done its own internal investigation, probably along with the NCAA, and that there are no fireable offensives. If they were, there would be no further contract extension talks.

There's a lot more in the piece that is informative for fans or rivals that want to understand the situation instead of mindlessly clinging to the rumor mill and characterizing JH as a blatant cheater.

https://mgoblog.com/diaries/best-and-worst-signs

[Jeff Buchanan]

https://scholarship.law.marquette.ed...3Dsportslaw%22

Don't read this unless you have a lot of time on your hands like I do ..... currently docked in La Spetzia Italy riding out a huge storm that has crossed the UK with 108mph winds and is presently affecting Spain and France. Hopefully the worst is over (it's been miserable today) before we depart for Marseilles this evening arrving there around noon.

Big coaches supposedly getting their panties in a wad over M's situation are doing so with complete knowledge that sign stealing is an accepted practice of sports teams.

Conclusion: Stealing signs in college football has become commonplace. Some may view it as gaining an unfair advantage, but the NCAA rulebook has only prohibited sign stealing when it is done live in electronic form. Sign stealing otherwise is considered acceptable behavior that is simply a part of the game. While some coaches may object to its use, the majority of college football coaches opining on the issue condone it, the NFL and MLB accept it in their respective leagues, the NCAA allows it, it has not been listed as unethical behavior under the Football Code, and several ethical theories support its practice. In today’s college football, where winning results in keeping your job and bringing in revenue for your school, a coach engaging in sign stealing is not just involved in an ethical practice, but it is a recommended best practice to keep up with their competitors.

[iam416]

What a steaming pile of shit.

As a general fucking FYI -- MLB does not accept all sign-stealing...see Houston Fucking Astros.

The most intellectually dishonest -- and I mean that -- DISHONEST -- approach is to say "everyone steals signs" -- at that point I completely disregard your opinion it's so obnoxiously stupid and dishonest.