Around the Big Ten

[Jeff Buchanan]

But kudos to you for somehow managing to play the victim.

I think it is obvious to anyone following this story that M, guilty or not, is presently being victimized. Your posts are a reflection of the larger media and Big coaches hit job on M and in particular JH. Other than speculation we can't fairly conclude that the things you are alleging took place - that the coaching staff was fully aware of and engaged in support of Stalion's activity - actually happened. I continue to believe that your imputed knowledge claim involving JH is weak and because of that the NCAA will not act on it.

TBH, I'm completely open to a finding that what M's critics would say supports a serious Level II violation occurred. Until that finding is announced I'm opposed to the hit job that is ongoing and will speak against it.

[iam416]

The doomsday scenario -- which I put at about 5% (up from 0.0001%) is that M is banned from B10 CG. That would present at least two huge issues: (1) M would possibly sue the B10; and (2) what would the CFP do? I haven't even begun to think about any of this b/c I still consider it remarkably unlikely. But that's the doomsday scenario. M is all-in on 2023 for their first outright national title since the Truman administration. There is zero way they go quietly into the night on 2023 -- if things are looking that way, my guess is they'd burn down 2021 and 2022 and suspend coaches -- but they're going to fight to the death for 2023.

But all of that is basically a massive longshot doomsday scenario.

[Mike]

100% due to Connor Stalions. The most successful evil genius in history. There isn't another single possible explanation as to why Michigan has been much better the last few years compared to previous seasons.

And let's be reasonable here. Michigan's issue prior to 2021 was almost entirely OSU. We beat everyone else with fairly regularly and entered the OSU game ranked 12, 3, 4, and 10 before breaking through in '21. It ain't like we're talking about Illinois suddenly caving in everyone's face for 3 years.

[Mike]

I hear the Pac-2 is looking for members.

This made me LOL.

[iam416]

I think it is obvious to anyone following this story that M, guilty or not, is presently being victimized. Your posts are a reflection of the larger media and Big coaches hit job on M and in particular JH. Other than speculation we can't fairly conclude that the things you are alleging took place - that the coaching staff was fully aware of and engaged in support of Stalion's activity - actually happened. I continue to believe that your imputed knowledge claim involving JH is weak and because of that the NCAA will not act on it.

TBH, I'm completely open to a finding that what M's critics would say supports a serious Level II violation occurred. Until that finding is announced I'm opposed to the hit job that is ongoing and will speak against it.

Well, we CAN fairly conclude that Stalion's activiity occured. You acknowledge that in your own damn post. And we CAN fairly conclude that the NCAA rules say the HC is responsible for his staff regardless of what the HC actually knows. We can conclude that by reading the damn rules. And beyond that, we can look at the facts, apply critical reasoning and make the obvious inference re AT LEAST the coordinators.

And the NCAA has never been your problem. Your problem was always whether M would crumple in contrition and then the B10. The NCAA isn't your problem b/c M doesn't care about shit beyond 2023. They're all-in. The NCAA will eventually be your problem, but not in 2023. M knows they're dirty cheaters, but the don't care so long as they beat the shit out of Georgia for the CFP. Which they will.

[Cody_Russell]

The doomsday scenario -- which I put at about 5% (up from 0.0001%) is that M is banned from B10 CG. That would present at least two huge issues: (1) M would possibly sue the B10; and (2) what would the CFP do? I haven't even begun to think about any of this b/c I still consider it remarkably unlikely. But that's the doomsday scenario. M is all-in on 2023 for their first outright national title since the Truman administration. There is zero way they go quietly into the night on 2023 -- if things are looking that way, my guess is they'd burn down 2021 and 2022 and suspend coaches -- but they're going to fight to the death for 2023.

But all of that is basically a massive longshot doomsday scenario.

My understanding is the CFP simply ranks the best teams on the field based on their protocols. Boo Corrigan explained it on Tuesday.

The NCAA can’t do anything to affect the current season due to timing.

It simply comes down to if the Big Ten conference does anything… I doubt it.

[Mike]

I'm not as convinced as you that we're just gonna waltz through the rest of the season unscathed. Hell, we've lost 6 straight bowl games and now it's a foregone conclusion that we'll beat, say, Ohio State, Texas, and Georgia in quick succession?

2023 is clearly the best shot we're gonna get, tho. It's like hunting a bear with a muzzle loader. Don't miss.

[iam416]

100% due to Connor Stalions. The most successful evil genius in history. There isn't another single possible explanation as to why Michigan has been much better the last few years compared to previous seasons.

And let's be reasonable here. Michigan's issue prior to 2021 was almost entirely OSU. We beat everyone else with fairly regularly and entered the OSU game ranked 12, 3, 4, and 10 before breaking through in '21. It ain't like we're talking about Illinois suddenly caving in everyone's face for 3 years.

You know my "reasonable" position. I've posted it several times.

I've always been clear that I will never argue the cheating changed outcomes b/c I can't know what that alternative world looks like.

What seems -- and I say "seems" -- clear is that B10 coaches (and probably ADs) are pretty offended by this operation whether they had a chance in hell of beating HARBAUGH****** or not.

Look, man -- I could rehash the entire Tressel/tattoos thing and make a much stronger case that none of that had jackshit to do with outcomes since it was all shit that happened while they were at OSU (and outside of recruiting) and that Tressel's truthfulness with the NCAA was irrelevant to any game outcomes. In fact, I probably did say that. And it didn't matter.

[Dr. Strangelove]

After 2019 it became obvious to HARBAUGH!!! that drinking milk, buying khakis, and practicing shirtless with the team was good enough to squeak past Iowa or Illinois, but it wasn't gonna help climb OSU mountain.

He was born into football royalty. Some no-name loser from New Hampshire was now beating him. Had to be infuriating. He got desperate and desperate men commit crimes.

[Mike]

My understanding is the CFP simply ranks the best teams on the field based on their protocols. Boo Corrigan explained it on Tuesday.

The NCAA can’t do anything to affect the current season due to timing.

It simply comes down to if the Big Ten conference does anything… I doubt it.

Right. The guy explicitly said "that's an NCAA issue, not a CFP issue" or words to that effect. They only entity that can derail Michigan, other than, you know A TEAM BEATING US, is the Big Ten office.

[iam416]

I'm not as convinced as you that we're just gonna waltz through the rest of the season unscathed. Hell, we've lost 6 straight bowl games and now it's a foregone conclusion that we'll beat, say, Ohio State, Texas, and Georgia in quick succession?

2023 is clearly the best shot we're gonna get, tho. It's like hunting a bear with a muzzle loader. Don't miss.

I dunno. I guess I'll temper my opinion on this slightly until the blast Penn State. If, for reasons other than a -7 turnover disadvantage, that game is competitive, then I may reconsider.

Ohio State has a team that could maybe hang around with M if M fucks up things. But OSU can't score. They just can't.

The real question, IMO, would be who M plays in the semifinal -- if that's a strong team then your theory starts to at least approach credible.

But, M is going to blast Penn State. So, meh.

[iam416]

Also, I think the B10 acting in some way other than the doomsday scenario is approaching more likely than not. If I were a M fan I'd be a bit nervous about a call between the Commish and ADs and I'd be a bit nervous that Rittenberg is floating shit like "the Commish needs to act or he'll lose the coaches and ADs."

It'd make me nervous. I watched how all this shit goes when UFM ended up suspended for 4 games.

[Mike]

It does make me nervous. But what the hell is the Big Ten supposed to do in the middle of the season when a full, LEGIT, investigation hasn't yet taken place? Then there's also the fact that the two biggest games of the conference season are yet to be played and that will settle things on the field. It would set an awful precedent. If I had to wager $5 on the subject of the Big 10 call today (assuming there is one), it would be that the commish is updating the ADs on where things stand and that they need to follow due process, yadi yada...

[Tom W]

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

[iam416]

Also -- the obvious weapon M has against the "doomsday scenario" is, well -- $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. To the extent FOX has any say in this, they ain't gonna want M doomsday'd. And I think they probably have a fair amount of say. 2021-22, 2024-future -- those are all fine. But don't touch 2023. Don't devalue the OSU-M game. Don't remove a B10 team from the CFP (and devalue the B10 CG).

If someone told me the B10 suspended HARBAUGH***** for the rest of the season, I'd say -- yeah, I can believe that. If someone told me the B10 barred M from the CG I'd say -- WTF, are you serious?