Around the Big Ten

[Jeff Buchanan]

PSU doesn't scare me. I have us 9-3 and getting completely humiliated om NYD by an SEC team. That reminds me, I need to secure Winter Classic tickets.

You're right. PSU doesn't scare me either but Michigan does and not in a good way.

I'll be very surprised if this coaching staff can fix what ails M's offense and we all have a pretty good idea of what that is. I suppose it's possible to win some games on D.

But if the turnover margin continues to be in the negative numbers to +1 AND the offense continues to be unable to run the ball, score points and run some clock, those wins by the D are not going to happen in the Hoke structured system as I understand it now.

Frankly, I think too much has to fall in place for 9 wins. 8 wins may be realistic but I'm still thinking based on the shit we've seen so far from the coaches dealing with the offense for two straight seasons, that's a stretch. Throw STs in there which ain't that strong except maybe Gibbons, and 7 wins seems to me to be more like it.

If I were Brandon, and IF a suitable alternative emerged, I'd fire Hoke with a 7-5 performance in 2013. Brandon simply cannot handle a crowd with pitch forks at the gates of the Fort and my view is that there will be one if what I feel will happen actually happens. He's got that 2.45 million dollar expansion he wants to leave as his legacy. If he sees that threatened by a decline in donations and ticket sales, he'll move if only to save his OWN ass.

BTW, I would hate that but its probably a pill that has to be taken providing the medicine is going to help the patient and that means a suitable alternative emerges.

[whodean]

I'd fire Hoke with a 7-5 performance in 2013. Brandon simply cannot handle a crowd with pitch forks at the gates of the Fort and my view is that there will be one if what I feel will happen actually happens

Absolute overreaction and fiction. No way is Hoke getting fired.

[hack]

Under Jeff's scenario, if there aren't pitchforks and torches than the alumni base just doesn't have a pulse.

I don't think it's that bad, though. I think the defense is going to round out into reasonable shape and make the team's record appear much better than the team actually was. My hope is that this doesn't let Borges off the hook. The young OL and the idea that DG owns the turnovers as opposed to Borges -- well, those excuses look a lot worse when opponents like Akron and UConn get run all over on the ground by teams Michigan should be destroying. Borges is a flop.

Hoke, though, is a fine HC for the future as long as he knows how to pick his co-ordinators.

[Jeff Buchanan]

......Hoke, though, is a fine HC for the future as long as he knows how to pick his co-ordinators.

Dunno. He brought Borges with him, right?

........ and JD, I would not dismiss out of hand the notion that Brady Hoke's job is at stake if he posts a 7-5 record. Granted, 7-5 may not happen, I would hate it if it did but I don't think he is entirely safe if it does.

The rumblings I have been told about with regard to Brandon's concern about not being able to raise the funding, through donations, seat and suite licenses, for his legacy athletic facilities expansion aren't fiction.

There is already a good deal of complaiing about the 2014 home ticket package and its cost. If M is going to play like a MAC program, the high rollers aren't going to pay to see that.

[hack]

The rumblings I have been told about with regard to Brandon's concern about not being able to raise the funding, through donations, seat and suite licenses, for his legacy athletic facilities expansion aren't fiction.


If you're basing it on some talk you're picking up, then, great. Good to hear. Michigan's fan base hasn't always been willing to play that role.

IMO Hoke is 1-for-1 on that front. And let's not take the recruiting for granted. I think the reasonable solution is talk about a new offensive-side staff. At worst, it buys you time to survey the market and make a smart decision. At best, you solve the problem and preserve what's good about Hoke -- the leadership, the recruiting, the fourth-down aggression, etc.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Points taken.

I'm just not that impressed with Hoke if you can use his first three seasons as a measure of his capabilities. He's a good face for the program. No doubt. Talks a good line. Looks like he recruits well? Can he coach? I'm not sure. Maybe as a line coach he's good except all that talk about fundamental is certainly not apparent on the field. Team 134 is not playing championship football? I have my doubts.

[Jeff Buchanan]

....... I don't think it's that bad, though. I think the defense is going to round out into reasonable shape and make the team's record appear much better than the team actually was.

Why? If the offense turns the ball over like it has been turning it over and continues it's horrific third down conversion rate, there is no way even a great defense can overcome that. You have to give the D a break. A breather.

Sorry, I just don't see anything good.

[Dr. Strangelove]

College Gameday going to Evanston next week for OSU-NU

[entropy]

Wait... Not an SEC game?

[whodean]

Sorry, I just don't see anything good.

I bet after the Minnesota win you will feel better about things.

[whodean]

the idea that DG owns the turnovers as opposed to Borges ...Borges is a flop.

It is incredibly convenient to pin Gardner's turnover troubles and M's offense performance under Hoke on Borges (he is after all a huge target), but I maintain it really comes down to the lack of real talent he has to work with.

Perhaps Borges (or any other O coordinator) will look better with the potential veteran Oline and better skill position talent headed M's way in the near future.

[hack]

You said that last week too, but Gardner's a five-star recruit at QB who has one of the best upperclassman WRs in the conference and the best LT. And no youth at WR or frustration with RBs is the cause of DG's bad decisions.

Borges would look better with better players. You can say that about any coordinator. My concern is not whether he would look better with better players, but why, with his players, doesn't he look better than the OCs at Towson State, U of Buffalo, or any of the other coordinators of offensive units that have beaten up on Akron and UConn yet with inferior talent.

[hack]

Why? If the offense turns the ball over like it has been turning it over and continues it's horrific third down conversion rate, there is no way even a great defense can overcome that. You have to give the D a break. A breather.

Sorry, I just don't see anything good.

My reasoning is, simply, that it can't keep going at that rate. It's an utterly insane rate at which to be turning over the ball. I don't expect the most effective of responses from the coaching staff but I do think they will manage a degree of success in that area. At the same time the D will show improvements in larger increments. Those trends are going to be self-reinforcing as DG relaxes and knows he doesn't have to win the game himself.

One game at a time, in terms of end-of-season projections. Right now, I'm at 9-3.

IMO Michigan must win @MSU and against OSU to avoid remaking the offensive side coaching staff.

[Mike]

Best focus on the former if we care about realistic expectations.

[hack]

To be clear, IMO it would take a performance absolutely none of us expect here for the offensive coaches to save their jobs. Or, at least, Borges. Maybe Funk. Borges has had his chance. All over the map and yet predictable. Makes you wonder if they just practice way too many plays and packages. And, the players aren't developing. He looks like a stock character in sports, to me: the guy that thinks he can win with his playbook and doesn't pay enough attention to the fundamentals as a result.