Around the Big Ten

[iam416]

MSU's recruiting and attrition is hurting them more than anything right now. You can't continuously unearth Jerel Worthy and Darquez Dennard in every class. I think that it was the '16 class, in particular, that was devastated by attrition, and the '17 class was mediocre as hell.

I think that's right. I also think the coordinator point is a fair one, though it's overstated.

The offense should be better, IMO. Lewerke, I think, is solid. They have a good set of WRs. The RBs are fine. But, man, the OL looked bad against ASU.

[Jeff Buchanan]

talent ..... heh. That was a fuck-ton of big words in your post about AA and me. Approaches my prodigious vocabulary and use thereof.

Well, M's OL looked like shit against ND too but, IMO, assessing OL function is not the same as evaluating football strategy and tactics. I think they may be interdependent to some extent, i.e., JH schemes around Jon Runyan's alleged shitty Pass-Pro, but I think it's wrong headed to hit up a HC's approach to the game - scheme and opponent adjustments that might be made pre-game or in game based on what the OL looked like, i.e., you can't determine the entirety of Dantonio's or Harbaughs approach to the game by looking at OL play in isolation..... I don't think I'm telling you anything you don't know but the uninformed masses probably don't so, I'm clarifying this point.

[THE_WIZARD_]

If there is a bigger collection of fucksticks in this world...I'd sure like to see it...

I'm guessing not.

[AlabamAlum]

Not everyone be a Ogallallaalla elite, wiz.

[Hannibal]

IMHO MSU has more of a problem with scheme than coordinators. They have the same problem as us -- they need elite, future NFL draft picks to excel against a good defense. Sometimes they don't even excel against a bad defense and it's very rare to see them run the ball effectively against a good defense. They had that one huge year where they beat Baylor in the bowl game, but other than that, their offense has usually been mediocre or just downright bad.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Vallentti thinks it's coordinators and I have no clue ..... just don't pay attention that much to MSU but, from the little I do watch of them, Dantonio runs an NFL style offense. I'm not sure he uses 11 personnel formations. Does he use TEs? I think he does. He definitely has his QBs in the shot-gun or pistol and also under-center. I've seen PA but, not sure about incorporating RPO or Read Option into a WCO conept passing game. Anyone?

If he is trending like most CFB coaches are to run-centric, 11 personnel formations and using WCO passing concepts, and I'll bet he is, then it isn't scheme IMO, it's execution or coaching. Still, I'm glad Valentti is ragging on Mork. Good stuff.

[iam416]

You and your "11 personnel" -- heh. Ohio State was running 11-personnel out the ass way before HARBAUGH!!!! Hell, isn't HARBAUGH!!! still recruiting fullbacks?

[AlabamAlum]

Nick Saban INVENTED the 11 personnel system!

[iam416]

Well, I mean, The Nick invented football and every aspect related thereto that works. So, yeah...duh

[AlabamAlum]

Incorrect. Bryant is the All-Father. Saban is his appointed heir.

[iam416]

Blasphemer

[Hannibal]

Vallentti thinks it's coordinators and I have no clue ..... just don't pay attention that much to MSU but, from the little I do watch of them, Dantonio runs an NFL style offense. I'm not sure he uses 11 personnel formations. Does he use TEs? I think he does. He definitely has his QBs in the shot-gun or pistol and also under-center. I've seen PA but, not sure about incorporating RPO or Read Option into a WCO conept passing game. Anyone?

If he is trending like most CFB coaches are to run-centric, 11 personnel formations and using WCO passing concepts, and I'll bet he is, then it isn't scheme IMO, it's execution or coaching. Still, I'm glad Valentti is ragging on Mork. Good stuff.

"I'm really nervous about facing that team who runs from under center with an immobile quarterback, a fullback, and a tight end most of the time" -- said no fan, ever.

[AlabamAlum]

I am a Bishop in the Church of the Pachyderm! Do not argue with me about Yellowhammer Canon!

[froot loops]

"I'm really nervous about facing that team who runs from under center with an immobile quarterback, a fullback, and a tight end most of the time" -- said no fan, ever.

Lewerke is not immobile, far from it.

That game sucked, but it wasn't unexpected. MSU was bound to have trouble out there. Valenti rightfully rags on the coordinators but some of it is the talent. The Chewins injury has really hurt them, he's a really good tackle that was unearthed as a walk-on but if you have to play centers at LT in his absence you are in trouble.

They should get it together, but if you want to compete on the biggest stage you have to recruit better. They rarely have the depth you need.

[Jeff Buchanan]

You and your "11 personnel" -- heh. Ohio State was running 11-personnel out the ass way before HARBAUGH!!!! Hell, isn't HARBAUGH!!! still recruiting fullbacks?

Sure ...... I think Bo and Woody ran "11 Personnel." Full-backs and TEs predominated. Bo put a WR out there once or twice a game and called him a flanker. Neither of them did much passing and neither did anyone else.

So, get with the program ....... the reason I keep harping on this term is because the masses have two football schemes: Pro-style and spread. That's just wrong. That doesn't come close to describing the kinds of schemes that are being run at the pro or the college level. I'm working to change the dialogue here as hard as that seems to be.

Its my view that CFB offenses are moving closer to the pros because CFB defenses are getting much better at defending all the spready or air-raid stuff that was the rage when Oregon was cheating and being really good and Mike Leach was locking Adam James in the closet at A&M. Given the weather in November in BIG country and it should be no surprise any of the contenders are running those offenses.

Not to mention that mobile QBs that were also a big deal in that era I mentioned above aren't lasting an entire season anymore let alone a couple games when facing modern defenses stocked with Clelin Ferrells and Nick Bosas. CFB schemes are evolving, like always. So, know your terms and get it right this season. MSU is not running a pro-style offense and to say that no fan says "I'm really nervous about facing a team who runs under center .........." is just absurd mockery from someone who I know is a lot smarter about football than that.