M-Borg vs. THE Flavortown U Thread, Orig. by Buckeye Paul, absconded w/by talent.

[iam416]

Brady likes Michigan because its Michigan

Yeah. And he liked Ball State because its Ball State and SDS because its SDS. Don't be a child. Every move he has made has been up. It's what ambitious folk do.

The B10 and P12 aren't dropping out of CFB. Ludicrous.

[hack]

I could see, if the Big and Pac really did have an equal amount of leverage, something like that happening. But even though they probably have enough leverage to deligitimize the system if they opted out, they don't have enough not to suffer profoundly under such a system. I think you'd see recruiting drop pretty quickly and the quality of coaching would decline too. Maybe a guy like Hoke wouldn't jump ship, but others might and vacancies would be less attractive. IMO this would be a might makes right situation, and although those two conferences have a lot of it, they don't have enough to take on the rest of the country by themselves.

[hack]

To be clear, however -- Hoke would have walked here. He's here. Urban probably won't be around much longer than 5 years or so. And I do suspect that doing the breakaway-conferences thing would be very, very deleterious to his health for about one season or so.

[Jeff Buchanan]

If the ADs coaches and players were deciding the future of CFB in the post BCS era, the idea of the PAC12 and B1G opting out and leaving the SEC on the door step would never happen. But they're not.

The college presidents are. I don't think the specter of the money to be made from college athletics is a positive but rather a negative for this group of deciders. I agree, taking these two conferences in this direction would mark the end of "competitive" CFB as we see it today ..... but that may be the objective.

On the margins there are powerful forces that have serious questions about the changing role of athletics at university. Granted, those with the money that would fashion the future of college sports are driving the boat right now but things could change in a heart beat given the role of the presidents in this matter and the tendency of the conference commisioners to put their objectives at the fore.

[lineygoblue]

Yeah. And he liked Ball State because its Ball State and SDS because its SDS. Don't be a child. Every move he has made has been up. It's what ambitious folk do.

Its what people do who have an ultimate goal in mind. Hoke's ultimate goal was to one day become Michigan's head football coach. He kept himself occupied and honed his craft at Ball State and San Diego State until the opportunity for Michigan's job came along. His once in a lifetime opportunity presented itself, and he came to Michigan. I don't believe that Coach Hoke has any intention of ever leaving Michigan for the NFL.

Ultimately, I also doubt that the B1G and Pac 12 leave the BCS, or whatever college football will call itself, in the future. But I think the two conferences, along with the Rose Bowl want the threat of that to be something that the rest of CFB looks at, and sees as a real possibility. As I said, you're not bluffing when you really have a good hand. The B1G and Pac 12 along with the Rose Bowl could survive just fine, thank you, without the rest of CFB and the BCS, if it had to come to that. Some network would throw a few billion dollars at an arrangement like that and give the conferences all the national exposure they need.

[iam416]

leaving the SEC on the door step would never happen.

That's not what they would be doing. They would be withdrawing from the sport as the SEC, B12, ACC, MWC, Big East -- every other conference -- moves forward. As a result, they'd condemn themselves to total mediocrity.

The college presidents are. I don't think the specter of the money to be made from college athletics is a positive but rather a negative for this group of deciders.

It SHOULD be a positive -- as EDUCATORS. That money funds intercollegiate athletic opportunities for hundreds of student-athletes -- TRUE student-athletes. Ohio State pours all of its revenues back into its AD -- that's why they have 35 some scholarship sports. That's why they give scholarships to fencers, women's field hockey players, wrestlers, swimmers, etc. -- the true student-athletes. It's all because of football. And we're not even touching on the value of football to the actual University in terms of fund-raising. They may not like the prominence of football, but they'd be total failures if they didn't appreciate the value big-time football brings to the University and, even worse, if they pissed on it.

There is no way the Big Ten and P12 are going to condemn themselves to irrelevance.

[iam416]

As I said, you're not bluffing when you really have a good hand. The B1G and Pac 12 along with the Rose Bowl could survive just fine, thank you, without the rest of CFB and the BCS, if it had to come to that.

Yeah. I just really disagree with that. They would wither.

[whodean]

Survive, yes, but suffer greatly. It would be a completely idiotic move and isn't going to happen.

[iam416]

whodean speaks the truth.

[UMStan White]

"Delany and Hancock insisted the Rose Bowl won't stand in the way of change.
"Everybody is going to have to make some changes," Hancock said. "Everybody recognizes the importance of the Rose Bowl."

Quote from article in Indystar about the BCS talks

[lineygoblue]

I think the threat is all the B1G, Rose Bowl and Pac 12 needs.

The SEC could take the remnant of the Big 12, along with the ACC, Big East, Notre Dame, etc., and form a new BCS alliance without us, but who else besides the SEC wouild be a credible threat to play in the MNC game? No ACC team is ever going to beat out an SEC team in a head to head situation. Notre Dame hasn't been a MNC threat for over a decade. About the only teams who could challenge the SEC would be Texas and Oklahoma. Nobody wants that either.

At some point, the BCS, or whatever it calls itself, is going to have to sit down at the table with the B1G and Pac 12 along with the Rose Bowl, and give them some serious concessions.

IMO, the B10, Pac 12 and Rose Bowl alliance would be fine for a 2-3 year period while the rest of CFB allows itself to be dominated by a steady diet of the SEC in the MNC chase.

.... in other words, the same thing thats going on now....

[hack]

ND would stick as an independent to preserve its trad rivalries with both conferences, but, yeah -- in the end, this is about leverage only. The two conferences are not going to opt out, no matter how entertaining the scenario might be. And while I am totally sympathetic to Jeff's idea, remember that these are executives of universities. Yes they may want to reduce the influence of athletics, but not nearly as much as they want the money to keep flowing. That type of move for a person like MSC is a once-in-a-career risk that could blow up in her face. Going with the flow is not. If she takes the risk, success would be shared with many others and their names would be soon forgotten. Failure means a huge step down and a bit of notoriety that won't ever leave her. So as much as she may want to do something like that, the system's incentives regime points her the opposite way.

[Pasadena Blue]

It would be nice though if the B1G and PAC could forge an alliance with the other conferences excluding the SEC.

If the better teams of what remains of the Big East could be redistributed amongst the ACC and Big12 .... you could see the Big 12 and ACC champ meet in the Orange Bowl to play the Rose Bowl champ in a title game (maybe in Fiesta Bowl venue).

The SEC can go F themselves playing against the MWC/WAC champ in the Sugar Bowl.

B1G and PAC going on their own without at least two other conferences joining in is not viable.

[Tony G]

No ACC team is ever going to beat out an SEC team in a head to head situation. Notre Dame hasn't been a MNC threat for over a decade. About the only teams who could challenge the SEC would be Texas and Oklahoma. Nobody wants that either.

Thing is, the others like the ACC and Big East would have an advantage in recruiting over the B1G and the Pac 10. Their players would at least have a shot at playing in the title game. Players in the B1G/Pac alliance would never have that chance. We would lose that War of the Roses quite soundly

[hack]

I'd say that were there one more conference to join the revolution, that would be enough. If it was the leftovers of the 12, that's more or less every elite team outside the SEC, no? Or the Big East might be enough. Nobody's going to care about an MNC in which the SEC plays itself every year.