M-Borg vs. THE Flavortown U Thread, Orig. by Buckeye Paul, absconded w/by talent.

[lineygoblue]

I care about the game too. I haven't cared as much lately, because there has been no doubt about who was going to win. There was no suspense, no real buildup. Its just been a crowning ceremony for the schmucks.

When it gets back to being a level playing field, with both teams fairly matched, then my interest will return.

And, in addition, I want to see Michigan Stadium filled with Michigan fans for "the game", instead of seeing 40% "red".

[Jeff Buchanan]

LOL...Michigan loses 9 out of 10 and suddenly you don't care about the Game much anymore. Ah Jeff, Jeff...

To be totally honest, DSL, yes, I still care but I care about as much for The Game right now as I care at present about some big event in my distant past that has become nothing but a faded memory.

I was at the 69 game when it all started. It was glorious as much as I am sure experiences you had when tressel turned it around after a decade of futility by john cooper.

But there is really something missing; I don't think it is going to be like it once was because its historical value is declining in the consciousness of those who might care about such things that are traditional.

I'm sure you're a stand-up osu fan, much like talent, who I have met personally. If you go back far enough to have valued The Game like I once did - and even though talent is not that old, he has a room in his basement where the alter of osu is worshiped on a daily basis so, he's OK and I count guys like that on my level with respect to passion for your alma mater's football team - you have to understand that events of the last decade and certainly those of the last few days have done a lot of damage to a proud tradition.

[Rocky Bleier]

Bo > Woody. Ferentz is as dirty as Tressel. Saban is probably dirtier. Neither Hoke nor Brandon really support Tressel. Jack Nicklaus ...went to tosu.

[entropy]

[Ghengis Jon]

LOL, Ent! Thats one of the best images yet!

[hack]

I don't believe OSU will have the sanctions some here are hoping for..

What's your take then? When a guy like Spielman is talking beyond-USC on the radio, the investigation time extended, etc. -- makes it look pretty bad, but I do not follow to the extent many do here the ways of the NCAA...

[Rocky Bleier]

MGOBLOG Brian:

The major differences:

1. Tressel lied to the NCAA multiple times; Fisher didn't.
2. Michigan fired Fisher immediately and without regret, then went into their Day Of Great Shame routine. Ohio State tried to convince everyone this was worthy of a two game suspension.
3. Ohio State had plenty of warning in the public eye from the Clarett accusations and the Smith handshake. Michigan had never brushed up against similar allegations.

[Hannibal]

Bo > Woody. Ferentz is as dirty as Tressel. Saban is probably dirtier. Neither Hoke nor Brandon really support Tressel. Jack Nicklaus ...went to tosu.

Frerentz runs a thug program. Not sure if he's dirty like Tressel though.

[Jamie H]

Strangelove asked how a compliance department can stay on top of kids for violations? Well this is how: (Story from MGoBlog):

As someone who once helped a football player fix his car, Michigan compliance was so far up my ass there was a blue lot in my lower colon and I almost got my own blue bus stop. The player bought the tie rods and I did the labor since I knew how and had the tools. He paid me for my time in beer and pizza. Compliance jumped all over this and figured out the hourly rate for a mechanic was greater than the cost of the beer and pizza, thus he still owed me money. I attempted to lowball my time estimate for doing the job, they talked to a real mechanic and got the official time estimate for tie rod replacement. They were also unimpressed by the fact I helped all my friends fix their cars in exchange for beer and pizza. So they basically stood over him while he wrote me a check for what they demanded the difference was. They also made him pay my uncle who let us use the lift in his garage.

I tossed the check aside and figured "I might cash this if he gets drafted, maybe". Someone though noticed the money never came out of his account and started calling me about cashing the damn check. This was old school Carr era though.
The next time I worked on his car I sarcastically sent them an invoice (six page writeup for helping him replace two brake pads) "for their records", they crosschecked all my time estimates and sent me back an approval letter and a genuine thank you for the paper...

[Jeff Buchanan]

What's your take then? When a guy like Spielman is talking beyond-USC on the radio, the investigation time extended, etc. -- makes it look pretty bad, but I do not follow to the extent many do here the ways of the NCAA...

I only follow the NCAA to the extent that I read people who do follow it very closely and/or have ties to it in some way at Rivals but ......

The consensus view is that even before the revelations subsequent to the NCAA Letter of Allegations which we now know more about from the Dohrmann piece, osu was going to have a hard time avoiding tougher sanctions on tressel v. a Show Cause Letter making his firing a necessity, wins vacated for the 2010 season and probably some scholarship losses but not substantial ones. That would have been considered as less punishment from the NCAA than they delivered to USC .... and there is good reason for that. Up until just recently, there was the appearance that osu both self reported and cooperated; USC stonewalled and flipped the bird at Mike Garret's behest; stupid but Garret thought he could muscle his way through the NCAA wash.

With the Dohrmann piece now out there and with the NCAA/osu now compelled to investigate further, if any of Dohrmann's allegations are shown to be accurate (keep in mind, proof in a legal sense is not necessary), there is no question that osu will be facing some very tough sanctions. I can't say this for sure but realistically, if gee and smith are in on the hook-ups that allowed cash and bennies to flow freely to players, this is going to be a huge problem for osu. If they aren't, it's still a problem because they damn well should have known and put a stop to it but a lesser one. The dreaded LOIC flows from either circumstance - which to me is almost a foregone conclusion based on what we know right now - routinely carries tough penalties meant to send a strong message.

I have heard penalties from people who understand how the NCAA works and how they penalize as onerous as 5 years probation, 3 years post season ban and up to 40 scholarships. I really can't speak to the accuracy of that estimate but it comes from sources who are generally reliable.

[entropy]

What's your take then? When a guy like Spielman is talking beyond-USC on the radio, the investigation time extended, etc. -- makes it look pretty bad, but I do not follow to the extent many do here the ways of the NCAA...

OSU will punish themselves and serve up Tressel and Pryor as fall guys. NCAA will accept the self punishment. The NCAA won't want to hurt OSU too much.

plus, I lack faith in them.

[hack]

The news that they're going back further into the past kinda escalates things, no? When you have Troy Smith and also Maurice Clarett as potential starting points, things seem to be looking a lot worse. Again, I'm just using common sense, which I understand may or may not apply...

[Rocky Bleier]

OSU will punish themselves and serve up Tressel and Pryor as fall guys. NCAA will accept the self punishment. The NCAA won't want to hurt OSU too much.

plus, I lack faith in them.

I think Smith may be let go and Gee will "retire" in the not too distant future.

[hack]

Again, relying on common sense only, canning Smith would resonate to me as a gesture that should reduce punishment. OSU had already been through this with Clarett and Troy Smith. That says something about Gene Smith.

[JRB]

OSU will punish themselves and serve up Tressel and Pryor as fall guys. NCAA will accept the self punishment. The NCAA won't want to hurt OSU too much.

plus, I lack faith in them.

Weren't you one of the many saying pretty much exactly the same thing about the USC case? This sort of sentiment didn't make much sense then, and it makes even less sense now. If anything, the COI's proven they want to crack down on major programs, and even if they did want to go easy on Ohio State for some reason, they'd be sacrificing a ton of credibility letting OSU slide after all the publicity this case has gotten. The only way Ohio State gets off light in this case is if the evidence simply isn't there to support many of the allegations we've been reading about for the last few days. I suppose that's possible, but even then, Tressel's misbegotten cover-up is going to cost them something.