M-Borg vs. THE Flavortown U Thread, Orig. by Buckeye Paul, absconded w/by talent.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I think it's patently unbelievable that if there's documentary proof Shelley Meyer knew about the 2015 incident, and was told directly by Courtney Smith, that she (Shelley) never told her husband (Urban) about it. So he therefore lied when asked.

I guess it depends on your POV if that rises to the level of a fire-able offense. I'm afraid I don't believe Urban was oblivious if Shelley knew. I don't understand his loyalty to this guy even if he was Bruce's grandson.

[AlabamAlum]

Heh. How are you Berzerklie?

[AlabamAlum]

Can we all agree that the BigTen has supplanted the SEC as Scandal Central (TM).

[Rocky Bleier]

Strangelove,

To quote Alonzo Harris from Training Day,"It's not what you know; it's what you can prove."

[Dr. Strangelove]

Can we all agree that the BigTen has supplanted the SEC as Scandal Central (TM).

Only because Mike "Corleone" Slive brought peace to the families and enacted the "snitches get stitches" policy. Longing for the day when the SEC hires a Sonny or Fredo.

[iam416]

I like the fact that she told her parents and they told her to keep quiet. HER PARENTS.

[iam416]

[AlabamAlum]

Only because Mike "Corleone" Slive brought peace to the families and enacted the "snitches get stitches" policy. Longing for the day when the SEC hires a Sonny or Fredo.

May he rest in peace. Truly a good fellow.

[JRB]

The Urban pressuring narrative would make more sense to me if this was a star player or a coordinator. Wasn't Zach a GA at Florida and a WR coach at OSU? GAs are completely expendable and WR coaches are a dime a dozen. I understand the Bruce connection, but would that be enough for Meyer to do that? Doesn't seem likely. At least to me.

Many college football coaches are ferociously loyal to their staffs. Either Meyer felt Smith was worthy of protecting, or he didn't. Again, I don't know if Meyer took any action to persuade Courtney Smith to drop charges against Zach Smith, in 2009 or at any other time. But I'll put it this way. Let's say I'm a graduate student dating another graduate student, and I abused her. Let's say my department head knew about it, and out of some misplaced loyalty toward me, tried to pressure my abused former girlfriend into keeping the matter quiet. Perhaps I have too much faith in some institutions, or perhaps it's just that I understand university politics reasonably well, but I don't think there's a university I've ever been around where that department head wouldn't be in a world of trouble if knowledge of his behavior got out. I tend to think that would have been true 10 or even 20 years ago, too-- maybe 20 years ago, that department chair would be asked to retire rather than be publicly fired, but there still would have been a reckoning.

Now, maybe in this instance, it is just PR, and maybe it is just a result of the MeToo movement or present-day SJW advocacy. I don't know the internal culture at Ohio State(thank God), so I can't argue against that. But I will argue that matters of public relations and gender equity are especially sensitive topics on college campuses, and university employees are expected to understand that. Urban Meyer's been doing this a long time-- that expectation is not news to him. I would hope that this matter is resolved favorably for all involved. If he did mishandle this situation, though, he picked the sort of hill university employees often die on.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Look all you media lovers ...... I'm all for a judgment on a perpetrator of an offense that is fact based and proves a violation of the law, organizational policy or contract provision given due process. I don't give a fuck about what the media opines and there is way too much of that kind of thing in the press these days masquerading as fact. I think the Meyer accusations are a good example of this as is all the innuendo swirling about right now about Meyers time at UF.

Too often there is a rush to judgement, flamed by outrage and that outrage stoked by media reporting, which, IMO, is overly subjective with the motivating factor for printing such stories being revenue generation. Right now I believe there is a conflict of interests between reporting the facts and stating them as such and making money without regard to them within top news organizations such as the mainstream US news outlets. Plenty of journalists have called for higher standards of reporting. Maybe, Hack, you're' not among that group or so it would seem.

The media has to be held more accountable for creating these firestorms following discovery of tantalizing tid-bits (I called them prurient interests) that then precipitate unfair, subjective based outcomes. I'm completely aware of the value of the press in unraveling and getting to the bottom of cover-ups like those that occurred at MSU and PSU and elsewhere. It is stupid to not recognize that positive outcome when crimes are uncovered and later proven to be such.

At the same time, it's my view that the media must also be held to account for the collateral damage they are often responsible for in these matters when they stoke early outrage over claims of sexual misconduct, domestic violence and the like, later proven to be factually unsupportable. Frequently, allegations of these crimes aren't fully investigated because accusers and the accused didn't want to go through the media circus that might surround such an investigation and trial, civil or legal. The damage doesn't go away for them, though. Ask the literally hundreds of high profile accused people who have resigned their positions facing accusations like this without any due process that might allow for discovery of the facts in support of innocence or guilt. Likewise, accusers drift into anonymity rather than face public scrutiny and the high cost of trying to prove the veracity of the allegations.

There has to be some balance in these matters and right now, I think a good case can be made that less than fact based reporting and innuendo fueled by media reporting is tipping the scale of justice unfairly to their side.

[froot loops]

I don't have much to add other than its best to get as much evidence as possible before making any judgments. There are some fishy points in the story but you need to know more.

OSU won't be the last place to go through this type of scandal. A lot of this is needed cleanup in how you deal with this stuff, but you can't go back in time to enforce 2018 mores on incidents in 2009.

[iam416]

So, your department head pressures your girlfriend to keep it quiet AND reports it up the proper channels? Fascinating, Bezerklie.

[iam416]

[AlabamAlum]

Many college football coaches are ferociously loyal to their staffs. Either Meyer felt Smith was worthy of protecting, or he didn't. Again, I don't know if Meyer took any action to persuade Courtney Smith to drop charges against Zach Smith, in 2009 or at any other time. But I'll put it this way. Let's say I'm a graduate student dating another graduate student, and I abused her. Let's say my department head knew about it, and out of some misplaced loyalty toward me, tried to pressure my abused former girlfriend into keeping the matter quiet. Perhaps I have too much faith in some institutions, or perhaps it's just that I understand university politics reasonably well, but I don't think there's a university I've ever been around where that department head wouldn't be in a world of trouble if knowledge of his behavior got out. I tend to think that would have been true 10 or even 20 years ago, too-- maybe 20 years ago, that department chair would be asked to retire rather than be publicly fired, but there still would have been a reckoning.

Now, maybe in this instance, it is just PR, and maybe it is just a result of the MeToo movement or present-day SJW advocacy. I don't know the internal culture at Ohio State(thank God), so I can't argue against that. But I will argue that matters of public relations and gender equity are especially sensitive topics on college campuses, and university employees are expected to understand that. Urban Meyer's been doing this a long time-- that expectation is not news to him. I would hope that this matter is resolved favorably for all involved. If he did mishandle this situation, though, he picked the sort of hill university employees often die on.

Urban has a reptilian brain. I think that precludes most emotion and certainly loyalty.

Kidding aside, I think it much more likely that Zach's wife didn't want him fired. She had a family to raise and bills to pay. She said she encouraged him to take the job to begin with. She dropped the charges with the police. Her parents didn't report Zach and allegedly encouraged reconciliation. She benefitted way more from his continued employment than Urban did from his coaching skill, no doubt.

[froot loops]

We'll see, if nothing more comes out, Meyer will survive is my prediction.