M-Borg vs. THE Flavortown U Thread, Orig. by Buckeye Paul, absconded w/by talent.

[iam416]

As it relates to M (since Mitchell will most likely end up at M if OSU passes):

The appearance of Ahmir Mitchell, a four-star out of New Jersey, is the big news concerning the wide receiver group for the 2016 class. The main question is: Would Ohio State accept his commitment? At the moment, I believe that answer is "NO."

Who is ahead of Mitchell on the board? There are three players ranked significantly higher in Ohio State's eyes, Binjimen Victor, Donnie Corley and Nate Craig-Myers. While the Buckeyes do not appear to be leading for any of the three, Ohio State might be willing to chase all three all the way to National Signing Day.

Do they NEED a second outside receiver? That answer would be a resounding No, especially with four-star Austin Mack already in the fold. The second wideout needs to be a home run, or they will pass. Is Mitchell a home run, or a double off the wall? Right now, he's not a home run.

How does Mitchell get in? That one is easy. He needs to come to FNL, and show them what they have not seen to date, be it speed, polish, route-running, hands, or whatever. Blowing the doors off Urban Meyer and Zach Smith might be the only way Mitchell puts his name in the "taker" category. It's easily one of the top stories of Friday Night Lights to follow.

The other thing playing into this is that the 2017 WRs OSU brings in will be the best group in the country. It's a sign of the very, very good times when Ahmir Mitchell isn't a TAKE for OSU at the moment.

Personally, I like Mitchell and would take him.

[iam416]

Oh, hack. You're just an awful, awful smack poster. OP is an awful poster but in a variety of different ways which are occasionally interesting. You never know when Putin is going to be linked to, say, Luke Fickell in some wildly bizarre way.

Anywho, I feel bad for you. It's tough. You'd prefer the rational, sensible discussion because you can't really smack, but OSU facts turn you white hot with anger and preclude any such thing. And so here we are. Good times for me, but eh, definitely a bit embarrassing for you.

[hack]

Im just glad you're wasting the material you have.

[Jeff Buchanan]

My view? ....... delusional M fans hanging on to the notion of HARBAUGH! are very likely setting themselves up for a dong punch.

The facts on the ground say this is going to take a while if the almost decade long damage done post Carr (2006) is reversible at all.

[Jeff Buchanan]

talent, this is for you and ufm ........

......"pay no attention to that man behind the curtain ......"

[ame]https://youtu.be/ubIpoPjBUds[/ame]

[iam416]

Heh.

[froot loops]

With HARBAUGH! it has a "It's just so crazy it might work vibe to it." It is amazing how he can consistently win the news cycle.

[Prime2]

DSL+Talent+now Buchanan ?

I'm beginning to regret my repeated indorsement of Talent, through crisis after countless crisis.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Don't worry OP ....... talent is a dick, an entertaining one, but nonetheless a dick.

The problem for the M crowd here, and what really gets under some of their skins (you excluded because you continue to fuck with him in an excellent way) is that he is right a hell of lot more often than he is wrong. He works in a world of facts upon which conclusions should be drawn instead of the world of supposition from which so many here base their generally unsupportable views of the greatness of M football. This has a salutary effect on the delusional nature of M fandome ....... and, of course, HARBAUGH!!

I think this is good ........ because.

M football, right now, is not great and it hasn't been for a long time. In fact, it was never really good ...... elite ........ under Lloyd Carr and you have to go WAY back to find a time when M was elite and when you do that, football was a very different sport and form of entertainment back then.

So, I find all the HARBUAGH is a savior rhetoric tiresome. That talent is a dick and frequently mocks the delusions of the greatness of M football and HARBAUGH is an effective tonic for those delusional fans here.

Bottom line for me, HARBAUGH and the notion that JH is a great football coach and will elevate M football to its rightful place among the consistently elite teams of CFB, is an unsupportable position until the facts make it a supportable one.

[iam416]

Bottom line for me, HARBAUGH and the notion that JH is a great football coach and will elevate M football to its rightful place among the consistently elite teams of CFB, is an unsupportable position until the facts make it a supportable one

Yeah, there's not a lot there. There's plenty of facts, IMO, to support the hypothesis that JH will turn M into one of the top 3 programs in the B10. Taking that a step further and hypothesizing that M will be an "elite" program may be a stretch (depending on the definition of "elite").

And that's sort of an interesting question -- what is "elite"? So, I'll go my personal feeling about the years and years of Ohio State football I watched. Under Earle and Coop, Ohio State was a top 2 program in the B10. There were some dark days (88-92), but by and large they were 1 or 2 in the conference. However, they were never consistently in the national title picture. They had 4 teams from 1979-2000 with credible shots at a national title in November. Only 1 of those teams (1979) ever played a bowl game for the national title.

Under Tressel, OSU was the B10's best program and what I think of a borderline national elite. They had some really strong teams, but I'm not sure if they were ever the best team in a given year. Aside from the fantabulous upset of Miami, when they played world beaters they lost -- sometimes close (Texas), sometimes egregiously (USC, Florida) and sometimes meh (LSU). But they lost.

Under UFM it's the first time I'm watching OSU and thinking, yeah, they're the world beaters.

So, my scale:

1 -- Indiana
2 -- Big Ten mediocrity
3 -- Top 2/3 in the B10
4 -- Consistent top 10 nationally
5 -- Top 3-5 and CFP consistently.

It's possible that the B10 emerges as a stronger conference and 3 and 4 come to mean the same thing. They certainly haven't in the past 10 years.

So, JH entering at Level 2. Level 3 is something that seems extremely likely based on the existing facts. Level 4 should follow.

[Hannibal]

#4 is what I expect ouf of a Michigan football coach. If he is not there by the end of this decade then I will consider it failure.

[iam416]

Yeah, and that's an entirely rational expectation based on M's performance over the course of the previous millennium and JH's track record.

[Hannibal]

I can't reasonably expect #5 to be sustainable long term, but I at least expect a two or three year stretch where we are in there. Maybe one recruiting class that strikes gold and produces a few all-Americans, a Heisman trophy candidate, and a few more 1st team all Big Tenners. Similar to our '95 class in football and our '12 class in basketball.

[WM Wolverine]

#4 is the obvious expectation at M with small dips in both directions, years where they are NT contenders and years where they go 8-4...

M's lackluster recruiting in '14/'15 is likely going to bite them in '17 but hopefully it's just a small bump they can make-up for with getting the most out of their '14/'15 and later classes. By '18, hopefully JH will have a sustainable top 10 program.

[WM Wolverine]

It's really difficult for anyone to be able to sustain #5, you need the resources (talent) at a place like Florida, Texas, California, Ohio, LSU, Bama etc. and an elite coach too. Georgia could be there with their in-state talent and an elite coach but that'd be tough to do the same time that Saban is at Bama.