M-Borg vs. THE Flavortown U Thread, Orig. by Buckeye Paul, absconded w/by talent.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I ask again -- what precedent is there that indicates that OSU will get off easy because Tressel resigned?

Tennessee and Bruce Pearl? I don't know, go back and look at the history of programs that got show cause letters and fired their coaches

[*JD*]

Ent- Raiders?

[gjdodger]

I don't expect O-Lie-O to get SMU-like sanctions. The NCAA doesn't have the testicular fortitude to do something like that again.

I do expect that some wins will be vacated, perhaps a mild reduction in scholarships, and maybe even a repayment of some bowl revenue.

But to me, just the embarrassment alone is payment enough. I don't care what the NCAA does from here.

I didn't think so, either. Then the car thing came out and I said, "Uh, oh." Then the punk spilled the beans about how the car thing had been going on throughout Tressel's tenure and I said, "UHH, oh." Then I found out OSU refused to divulge correspondence between Tressel and Stepiak and I said, "UHHHH-OHHHH." I don't know what the NCAA will do, and I doubt it will be the death penalty, because that effectively terminated SMU's program for a decade--nobody realized that would happen at the time; they figured a couple years off and the Mustangs would bounce right back. But I agree with those who say USC is the starting point, and now the NCAA investigators have to keep adding to what they're investigating. This could take awhile.

[Hannibal]

You can join Hannibal and Jon and whomever else in the "OMG OSCHEAT IS GONNA GET WORST PENALTIES SINCE SMU HAHAHA" club if you want but do remember to take your heart medication. You will need it.

I didn't say worst penalties since SMU. I said that the O/U is 10 schollies a year for three years and a two year post season ban. Personally, I don't need that much to be satisfied. To a large extent, the damage has been done and the playing field will be level again.

Tennessee and Bruce Pearl? I don't know, go back and look at the history of programs that got show cause letters and fired their coaches

We'll see. Bruce Pearl's cheating was less severe than Tressel's and he gained less of a competitive advantage from it. Our basketball program got hit fairly hard even though we fired Steve Fisher immediately.

[Tony G]

I don't expect O-Lie-O to get SMU-like sanctions. The NCAA doesn't have the testicular fortitude to do something like that again.

I do expect that some wins will be vacated, perhaps a mild reduction in scholarships, and maybe even a repayment of some bowl revenue.

But to me, just the embarrassment alone is payment enough. I don't care what the NCAA does from here.

Uh also because the two crimes are a grand canyon width apart? For that Matter OSU's and USC's are a fair bit apart also. tat gate and possibly even cars pale compared to USC and CERTAINLY compared to not only SMU's sins but the levels to which the knowledge and in fact cover up of the sins permeated.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I didn't say worst penalties since SMU. I said that the O/U is 10 schollies a year for three years and a two year post season ban. Personally, I don't need that much to be satisfied. To a large extent, the damage has been done and the playing field will be level again.



We'll see. Bruce Pearl's cheating was less severe than Tressel's and he gained less of a competitive advantage from it. Our basketball program got hit fairly hard even though we fired Steve Fisher immediately.

Your program also had a booster making large cash payments directly to players while Bo's hand-picked bball coach helped him cover it up.

[Hannibal]

Your program also had a booster making large cash payments directly to players while Bo's hand-picked bball coach helped him cover it up.

Yup. That's why we deserved what we got. I think that the early '90s Michigan basketball program and the Tressel-era OSU football program is a valid comparison.

[lineygoblue]

I'd be fine with O-Lie-O getting hit with the football equivalent of NCAA sanctions that Michigan's basketball program got.

Our basketball program was turned to crap for over 10 years due to NCAA sanctions. A similar result for O-Lie-O football would be fine with me.

[Tony G]

Drew Sharp: NCAA won't unleash its full wrath on Ohio State

1:11 AM, May. 29, 2011 |




Ohio State coach Jim Tressel / AP


All those salivating in Ann Arbor and East Lansing about Ohio State getting punished by the high priests of hypocrisy (a.k.a. the NCAA punitive police) should do themselves a favor for the sake of their own emotional stability.
Stop using the serious USC sanctions as a barometer for what should happen to Ohio State.
There are no similarities between the two cases as it pertains to one extremely important variable in every NCAA investigation: the expectation of the institutions to self-report infractions because of the NCAA's limited investigative scope. The willingness of the investigated to fall on the sword and give the NCAA Committee on Infractions something in their program's official response to the allegations often determines how hard the NCAA swings the hammer.
Ohio State did that.
USC didn't.
The Trojans lost their appeal with the NCAA last week. No surprise. USC must sit out the bowl season for the 2011 campaign and endure a loss of 30 scholarships over the next three years. But what many don't realize is that the Trojans got hammered not for the sins committed, but rather how they responded once the transgressions were brought to their attention nearly five years earlier.
USC's own arrogance brought it down. Thumb through its formal response to the NCAA's Notice of Allegations last year and you'll find little accountability and even less contrition. The university basically dared the NCAA investigators to come after one of college football's marquee brands.
It's a mess in Columbus, worsening every day. There's no way that Jim Tressel should survive this scandal.
A former football player told the student newspaper, The Lantern, that "everybody was doing it" in reference to selling memorabilia for money and getting questionably sweet deals on cars. A car salesman told The Sporting News that he had several phone conversations with the athletic department's compliance officer regarding the NCAA legality of what's now become the Buckeye Motor Bureau. That's an accusation that directly contradicts the school's report to the Committee on Infractions.
It's only a matter of time before it's revealed that The Ohio State University lost its prefix after football players sold the "The" for a tire rotation on one of those special SUVs.
But there's an important point lost in the rush to bury the Buckeyes that bears repeating. Despite all appearances of decorum run amok, all the NCAA asks of its member institutions in these situations is to stay out in front of the matter. Don't obfuscate: Investigate. Admit you screwed up. Hit yourself over the head with the hammer first. Even those that overtly lie and cheat will still get leniency if they come across as forthright in their internal probe.
Ohio State's doing that.
USC didn't.
That's why the NCAA nailed the Trojans with the most severe major allegations allowable -- lack of institutional control and failure to monitor -- in its formal list of charges against USC. The Buckeyes avoided that double dilemma in its NOA last month.
The USC verdict is only relevant in how NOT to conduct yourself during a NCAA investigation.


Contact Drew Sharp: 313-223-4055 or dsharp@freepress.com .

[Dr. Strangelove]

The NCAA has made it clear, even very recently with the USC appeal, that it decides each case separately and doesn't use other schools as "precedent".

[Hannibal]

Everyone (including myself) thought that USC would get off easy, and they didn't. The rationale for OSU getting off easy is the same flawed thinking as it was with USC. "The NCAA has no balls." "The NCAA won't punish a cash cow". Well, guess what. The NCAA has proven both of those beliefs to be false. And now that USC has been punished, there is a precedent. I'm anything but a naive optimist and my spidey sense tells me that more violations are going to see the light soon and that OSU is going to get hammered hard. Everyone outside of Ohio who has followed the career of Jim Tressel knows that Tatgate was just the tip of the iceberg. The only question remaining is how much the NCAA will uncover and accept as proof.

The NCAA has made it clear, even very recently with the USC appeal, that it decides each case separately and doesn't use other schools as "precedent".

They can say this all they want, but at some level, everyone compares punishments.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Everyone (including myself) thought that USC would get off easy, and they didn't. The rationale for OSU getting off easy is the same flawed thinking as it was with USC. "The NCAA has no balls." "The NCAA won't punish a cash cow". Well, guess what. The NCAA has proven both of those beliefs to be false. And now that USC has been punished, there is a precedent. I'm anything but a naive optimist and my spidey sense tells me that more violations are going to see the light soon and that OSU is going to get hammered hard.

As I just said, the NCAA does NOT follow precedent. It views each case differently and is not bound to follow a sporting world's stare decisis.

And it's been established already that USC's administration handled the investigation extremely poorly.

[Tom W]

Tressel broke rules, but let's be honest, they're not exactly heinous rules. It would have been more fitting if he got busted for something like embezzling Andy Katzenmoyer's scholarship fund.

But Tressel is gone because he covered things up. So, in essence, he's Richard Nixon- disgraced but not exactly a worthy fate for the leader of an Evil Empire.

Woody would be very disappointed.

[gjdodger]

Tressel broke rules, but let's be honest, they're not exactly heinous rules. It would have been more fitting if he got busted for something like embezzling Andy Katzenmoyer's scholarship fund.

But Tressel is gone because he covered things up. So, in essence, he's Richard Nixon- disgraced but not exactly a worthy fate for the leader of an Evil Empire.

Woody would be very disappointed.

Exactly. There are violations, there are always going to be violations; the NCAA fields thousands of them every year. When the head coach is complicit and hides the violations for nine months, that's an institutional breakdown.

[Pasadena Blue]

I kind of agree with DSL.

As I understood form the mess hear at USC, the president and other key officials had a pretty good idea what the COI was going to hand down ... and this was IN ADVANCE of the meeting.

I suspect Smith/Gee sent out an informal feeler and they found out what was coming down and got the message that Tressel bowing out would lessen the penalties.

I think the NCAA slap is not going to be too hard here.

On the one hand I am very happy that the man who owns the 9*-1 (albeit now exposed as illegitimate) against M is tossed out in disgrace ... on the other hand, I think a damaged and sullied 'Vest still in place at an institution exposed for its lack of values and ability to what was right, would have been better for M in the long run.

Fickell has a much better chance now of righting the ship and keeping O-state's momentum going ... not a good thing for us M fans.