M-Borg vs. THE Flavortown U Thread, Orig. by Buckeye Paul, absconded w/by talent.

[Rob F]

Michigan was going in the "win at all costs" direction when they hired Rich Rod, weren't they? They thought that they were hiring a sure winner, one who was going to revolutionize play in the Big10, and didn't seem to care very much about his players getting into lots of trouble or his graduation rates. None of that was exactly stuff that only came out after the fact.

Martin was clueless about what he really wanted---both the who and the coaching philosophy involved---when he hired RichRod. Remember, his first choice at teh start of the "process" was Tony Dungy, even though there was absolutely no reason to believe Dungy was or ever would have been even remotely interested.

And, AIR, RichRod's WVa football graduation rates were NOT subpar.

[lineygoblue]

I probably would have fainted from shock, had Meyer become Michigan's coach after Coach Carr retired. Especially given the tirade against Michigan, and the Big Ten in general, in his campaign to get his Gators into the MNC game instead of Michigan. I think he burned any bridge that he may have had to Michigan at that time, and I think he knew it when he did it.

Meyer's alleged "out" clause in his various contracts have allegedly included the opportunity to coach at Michigan, ND and OlieO. He had a chance to coach at ND, and couldn't get them to lower their academic standards to allow the kind of athletes he needed for his program. So .. he burned his bridge to the Irish.

That left him with OlieO. He's from ohio, and he's an ohio man. He's where he wanted to be.

I think ohio fans have more to be concerned with about his health, than they do with the types of players that he will bring to their roster. They are already conditioned to accept players, regardless of their backgrounds, as long as they can win ballgames. Meyer will continue what Tressel started there. So, that's a wash. I think the biggest problem will be the stratospheric expectations that are on him to win, win big, and win all the time. One look at the average ohio fans' comments will indicate that they don't expect any losses. He's got a lot to live up to.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Meyer would've brought in elite recruits with him unlike RR who didn't recruit at a high enough level. He'd have won games, which is all that matters to the masses.

Not at Michigan. Winning games is a distant third to making sure the team attends church and gets good grades in advanced calc

[lineygoblue]

Winning games is a distant third to making sure the team attends church and gets good grades in advanced calc

Wrong, wrong, wrong ... Saint Jim was the one who loaded up the van and brought the boys to church on Sundays ... Just ask him .. he wrote a book about it, fer goodness sakes ...

[Pasadena Blue]

no one is saying winning is "third" at M, it's just not a win at all costs mentality. Heck, in general, we have not even been willing to pay top dollar to bring in the best coach possible.

I am sorry if no M fan here is willing to agree to your presumption that the culture is the same at Ohio and at M. Before you even fling your accusations that this M arrogance and that we are just like everyone else but just pretend to be above the fray ... I am not even suggesting the M approach is better. Obviously, the Ohio approach is better if you simply look at the results over the last decade. As much as we mock at talent's flagship reference, the reality obviously is that Ohio has been the dominant team. Michigan is what it is and has never been willing to do all that it takes to get to the top. I don't think that is necessarily better... it just is what it is.

[The Oracle]

Personally, I don't know many of my M Michigan fans that wanted Miles, nor did I, nor did the M administration that was in charge of hiring. But it's a good story.

[iam416]

What an utterly worthless discussion.

[hack]

Personally, I don't know many of my M Michigan fans that wanted Miles, nor did I, nor did the M administration that was in charge of hiring. But it's a good story.

Baffling to call it a ``story''. The details are out there about Miles I. Miles II is different. I could believe the idea that Brandon would never have. I could also believe that the buffoons at that level thought they could do better, and, once they realized otherwise, considered him again briefly.

[lineygoblue]

Miles wanted the job the first time around, and should have been hired. I would have much rather had Miles over that time instead of Rodriguez. I'm not convinced that Miles really wanted the job the second time around post-Rodriguez. And, I don't think Brandon really wanted him either. Brandon wanted Hoke, and it turns out Brandon made a good choice.

[hack]

Unclear that Brandon wanted Hoke, which is interesting. Now that we see him, it's obvious what a great candidate he was. I mean, when you have a guy like LC, who didn't have much of a coaching tree to start, you're not going to be prone to trusting what him and his supporters want. Is it even clear that LC wanted Hoke to succeed him, vis-a-vis someone like Debord, English, etc? So given that situation, once Hoke emerged in this recent coaching search the rational thing to do was to be skeptical of what that crowd wanted. Hoke totally looked like a nepotism hire, but it turns out that the guy is that rare creature who is as good as the praise he gets from his inner circle of supporters.

I don't blame any outsiders, such as the lot of us here, for not being familiar enough with Hoke to understand this. We lacked the information to do so. Brandon, on the other hand -- maybe he just wasn't around the program enough during Hoke's time here to see it. That seems reasonable. But Brandon's strength is marketing, and his priority was to go into the new-coach press conference with a guy he could call his #1 choice. We can all put 2 and 2 together and see that Hoke wasn't the first option, but because the process valued secrecy above all else we don't know if he was second or third or ninth.

Either way, what luck! Brandon made a nepotism hire via a process not much better than the previous disastrous one, and it turned out to be just the thing the program needed. Better to be lucky than good in life, right?

[lineygoblue]

I dunno, Hack.

My thought is that it didn't seem to me like Brandon went all-out after Harbaugh or Miles. None of us know for sure what happened behind the scenes, but it just didn't seem to me like Brandon made a determined effort to get Harbaugh, and quickly threw up a white flag when NFL teams got involved.

His "interview" of Miles was almost comical in how it was carried out. I don't think Brandon really wanted Miles, and after the way Miles was treated in the previous episode, I don't think he really wanted Michigan all that much. I believe that when Harbaugh came off the boards, Brandon wanted Brady Hoke. Miles and that "interview" was a dog-and-pony show.

I'm not disappointed in how things turned out. Harbaugh had a great year with the 49ers, Miles had a NC with LSU, (I don't recognize Bama as the NC), and Hoke brought Michigan from a 7-5 suckbutt team, to a 11-2 BCS participant.

Everyone seemed to do well with the results.

[iam416]

I believe the way M fans would describe it, if it's at all consistent with recruits who go elsewhere, is that Brandon cooled on Harbaugh and all other candidates other Hoke.

[hack]

Agreed that the Miles interview was a show. Pretty obvious in advance, IIRC, that it wasn't going to result in Miles taking the job. What I do know, however, is that Brandon's goal was to preserve the plausible claim that he got his #1 choice. That's what Brandon sees and understands. What I don't know is how hard he went after Harbaugh and how many of those little rumours between JH and BH were just smoke. It's just not possible to know because Brandon's goal required secrecy.

Talent what you mean specifically by ``cooled on''? As in, the option was there for JH and Brandon didn't take it? Or as in he wasn't gonna get JH and therefore decided to make it look like UM selected Hoke above others? Obviously my opinion is that it's the latter, but I'm open to new information...

[SeattleLionsFan]

I was reading in three and out that Hoke was the pick at the annual golf outing during Brandon's first offseason as AD. It's very possible that Hoke was at the top of Brandons list.

In any event it's clear that he was third choice at worst. But I never got the sense that Brandon was that interested in Harbaugh or Miles. At least given what it would take to get them.

[hack]

I think Bacon said something at one of his events about Brandon bowing out with Harbaugh once it was clear how expensive he would be, but memory sometimes fails. I think that ``given what it would take to get them'' makes the picture complete.