Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[CGVT]

This amount of damage on three fronts is unprecedented. It would be unreasonable to expect FEMA to be prepared for that level of destruction. They are just not big enough. BUT... It is not unreasonable for them to have considered and prepared a military response.

And sending a handful of Coast Guard Cutters with their limited supply space and endurance was not enough.

[AlabamAlum]

I think a good leader would articulate the need for additional volunteers and explain the unique situation presented by this years storms. JMO

Well, Trump is not a good leader. I'm not trying to suggest he is. My anti-Trump stance is fairly well known. I just don't find him, FEMA, or the Feds grossly and maliciously at fault for a slowed start to Puerto Rican recovery. Could it have been better? Sure.

YMMV.

[SeattleLionsFan]

Or an aid package, or waiving the Jones Act like they did for the mainland.

What has he done to try to address the obvious shortcomings of the response so far?

[hack]

Agreed that this amount of damage may be unprecedented, but it wasn't unimaginable. We've known that stronger storms are coming for a long time. Long enough for even government bureaucracies to prepare for them. Had they been given an appropriate amount of money, I bet they could have done just that.

[CGVT]

Agreed that this amount of damage may be unprecedented, but it wasn't unimaginable. We've known that stronger storms are coming for a long time. Long enough for even government bureaucracies to prepare for them. Had they been given an appropriate amount of money, I bet they could have done just that.

And even if they weren't totally prepared, a quick positive and very visible response would have been the right PR move. Perception is everything in these situations. You have to stay ahead of the bad PR.

Too bad the orange monkey was too preoccupied tweeting about Steph Curry and those damn unpatriotic NFL players to even make it look as if he was doing the right thing.

Covfefe!

[AlabamAlum]

I think you're all forgetting how poorly Obama did with Katrina!

[CGVT]

I think you're all forgetting how poorly Obama did with Katrina!

Ha! I guess we are.

[froot loops]

Ultimately, the President gets the blame whether he deserves it or not. If unfair criticism leads to a better response, that's good! Whether he likes it or not, he has the bully pulpit and it is expected that he use it to talk about things like this. When he doesn't and directs his attention to NFL and NBA players, he is the blame for the criticism. The kneeling in the NFL had been an issue that died down, he chose to inflame it. He's not a candidate, he won, start acting the part. You can't effectively be president and stew about every perceived sleight that Fox and Friends bring up.

The bulk of all the Katrina response criticism fell at the feet of George W. Bush because of FEMA and his appointee of Michael Brown. There are parts of the criticism that was justified. But he did get blamed for things that were ultimately not his fault, namely the mayor and governor's responses among other things. But Michael Brown was not qualified to be the FEMA head, an outcome of this criticism was the law to make it mandatory for the head of FEMA to have 5 years of disaster relief experience. That was a good outcome, FEMA was better prepared.

[THE_WIZARD_]

Well, Trump is not a good leader. I'm not trying to suggest he is. My anti-Trump stance is fairly well known. I just don't find him, FEMA, or the Feds grossly and maliciously at fault for a slowed start to Puerto Rican recovery. Could it have been better? Sure.

YMMV.

:::fart noises:::

[entropy]

Agreed that this amount of damage may be unprecedented, but it wasn't unimaginable. We've known that stronger storms are coming for a long time. Long enough for even government bureaucracies to prepare for them. Had they been given an appropriate amount of money, I bet they could have done just that.

You don't budget for worse case scenarios. But the gov't could have
responded better and helped FEMA.

[CGVT]

You don't budget for worse case scenarios. But the gov't could have
responded better and helped FEMA.

You have to have pulse contingencies though.

[The Oracle]

Still no FEMA in Dorado. No water either.

[crashcourse]

well lets see where this goes

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/27/us/politics/trump-tax-cut-plan-middle-class-deficit.html

[CGVT]

Hopefully in the shitter, right next to Trumpcare

[Jeff Buchanan]

I think you're all forgetting how poorly Obama did with Katrina!

Not sure that's relevant.

I think it is the scope of required relief effort and the lack of foresight at various levels about how to deal with it that is relevant.

The original post by Froot that started this convo was the piece that quoted Lt Gen Honore (ret.) that the logistics requirements to help the PR weren't identified nearly as early enough as they should have been by folks that should have known better.

FEMA did not have at it's disposal enough transport capability (ships and planes) to deliver the aid to PR. It's a huge undertaking getting the active Military Airlift Command (MAC) organized, mobilize the Reserves/National Guard and start loading and steaming the requisite Navy ships and Engineering support to do what is becoming obviously necessary in the PR to support even the most basic of living conditions.

I've seen all of these entities go from sitting around and drinking coffee to fully mobilized to meet the most demanding needs in 96h, sometimes less. This could have been done in under that time if just one person had seen what was coming and what was going to be required and started preparing for it. That was the crux of the Honore complaint and, IMO, it was spot on.

I suspect Trump thought the DHS and FEMA were handling it. I think FEMA probably thought it could handle it. All of them were wrong. That's the bitch and now US Citizens are suffering, some of the most vulnerable are dying becasue of that mistake in judgement.