Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[froot loops]

so 720 killed by police
620 were armed no problems there
60 of the remaining unarmed were white so that leaves 40 unarmed black men shot--20 were mentally ill or lunged at the officers weapons not that it matters

bottom line if you listen to what the officer asks you to do you wont be shot--if you continue to ignore or resist the officer you could get shot. My dad told me that when I was 10--doesn't everybody else no that

further articale from washington post--3x more likely to get shot if your white these days in exact situations when facing cops according to study

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.6d78a0afbbb6

Why is it no problem because they were armed? Should have Philando Castille expected to be killed because he was carrying a gun?

[iam416]

I don't know if there is a problem, although I suspect there is. With that said, I think it's a legitimate question that should be investigated and considered. It seems like Team Red largely refuses to do so.

Yeah, and all Team Blue wants to have everyone acknowledge there is a massive problem, accede all their solutions and beg for forgiveness.

[iam416]

Why is it no problem because they were armed? Should have Philando Castille expected to be killed because he was carrying a gun?

I think it's fairly clear crash was generalizing. But, whatever.

We know AAs aren't more likely to be shot than other races, including whites. Until Progs relent and acknowledge that fact, there is no discussion.

Same can be said about Red folks and frequency of stops.

IMO, the rhetoric and increasing way politics bleeds into self won't ever let that happen. Conceding "Hands Up Don't Shoot" is a hoax means agreeing with Team Red. Conceding AAs DO have a rougher go of it with police means agreeing with Team Blue. Meanwhile the perfectly sensible middle has no say.

[Mainevent]

For the 10 years I had season tickets at Ford Field, the loud, drunk, white assholes who sat behind me disrespected the national anthem a lot more than silent, kneeling players have done for a cause they deem just. I'd guess those are probably some of the same ones booing and claiming this is a great affront to our country.

[SeattleLionsFan]

I think it's fairly clear crash was generalizing. But, whatever.

We know AAs aren't more likely to be shot than other races, including whites. Until Progs relent and acknowledge that fact, there is no discussion.

Same can be said about Red folks and frequency of stops.

IMO, the rhetoric and increasing way politics bleeds into self won't ever let that happen. Conceding "Hands Up Don't Shoot" is a hoax means agreeing with Team Red. Conceding AAs DO have a rougher go of it with police means agreeing with Team Blue. Meanwhile the perfectly sensible middle has no say.

So if "progs" concede that police are murdering white dudes to, then we can look into police murdering dudes? That seems like an odd demand, since ALL lives matter, but ok. So long as the police stop murdering people, I'm happy.

[iam416]

ALL lives matter

That's racist. You need to get right with Tahiti Coates, SLF.

So if "progs" concede that police are murdering white dudes to

Yeah, so, that's not so concerning to them. Like, at all. So, I wouldn't hold my breath.

But, you know exactly what I said. An honest discussion about race-based policing has to dispense with the rhetoric talk about what is actually happening.

[froot loops]

I think it's fairly clear crash was generalizing. But, whatever.

We know AAs aren't more likely to be shot than other races, including whites. Until Progs relent and acknowledge that fact, there is no discussion.

Same can be said about Red folks and frequency of stops.

IMO, the rhetoric and increasing way politics bleeds into self won't ever let that happen. Conceding "Hands Up Don't Shoot" is a hoax means agreeing with Team Red. Conceding AAs DO have a rougher go of it with police means agreeing with Team Blue. Meanwhile the perfectly sensible middle has no say.

I'd to hear crash on that issue.

You are putting an awful lot of weight in that Harvard study that the Times used. It might be totally right, but it's data set was very small and more studies need to be done to get a comfort level. It was based on 10 police departments.

One of the problems that this study is that they don't have real good data on police killings at all.

[iam416]

You are putting an awful lot of weight in that Harvard study

It also conforms to general statistics -- AAs are 4X more likely to be felons than white folks and less than 4X less likely to be shot. It also conforms to the statistics in the study that are negative to the police -- i.e., AAs are far more likely to have interactions with the police (stops, etc). If you have increased interactions with a much higher rate of bad people then it seems almost obvious that macro results will be what they are.

The Harvard study was surprised (bordering on shocked) by its findings re shootings. I was not.

It was based on 10 police departments

I mean, ok. But, are you comfy with Ferguson + Baltimore?

[THE_WIZARD_]

Get right with TPM...

(Talent's Posts Matter)

[iam416]

Also, while Heather MacDonald is a staunch "blue lives matter" writer, and I suspect the study she cites re willingness of police to shoot folks based on their race has some holes (crash's WaPo link), there could be more truth to it than I think. I dunno -- I don't link it or rely on it -- but I also don't totally discount it.

[iam416]

Froot/SLF:

You're good people. You've thought about shit. Your takes aren't without merit. We disagree. Np. In fact, I'm way more comfortable with that than my apparent agreement with The Wizard.

So, you know what I'm going to say on most things as I've said it all a dozen times.

tl;dr -- covered all this; loading up for DTV rant

[THE_WIZARD_]

WPM

[whodean]

It also conforms to general statistics -- AAs are 4X more likely to be felons than white folks and less than 4X less likely to be shot. It also conforms to the statistics in the study that are negative to the police -- i.e., AAs are far more likely to have interactions with the police (stops, etc). If you have increased interactions with a much higher rate of bad people then it seems almost obvious that macro results will be what they are.

OK, but the shitty "war on drugs" is to blame for a lot of that 4x re: blacks

[iam416]

OK, but the shitty "war on drugs" is to blame for a lot of that 4x re: blacks

Yeah, the "WoD" is shitty, no doubt. You can remove "non-violent" felonies and the rates are the same (or worse). AAs commit more murders, in absolute terms, than any other race. That is certainly drug-legalization related, but, I mean, that's some violent shit. And it follows down the line.

So, I mean, the point still stands if you excise non-violent felonies.

Now, the whole discussion in incarcerating folks for non-violent drug crimes is another issue. There's lot to it (IMO), but I probably come out with you re "shitty".

[froot loops]

I think the matter needs to have a lot more data. I'm not sure if it was the Ferguson report or the reporting on Ferguson by Radley Balko. The data can be badly interpreted, if you have a local police force squeezing it's citizenry with bs to pay for a budget and they can't so they have a record or a warrant out for them they might fall into the same category with an actual real bad person.

But in regards to the Kaepernick issue, nobody really protests or speaks out only when the data affirms their suspicions. Most people who lead protests are flawed, most protests don't lead to any meaningful change at all. As far as protests go, this one has drawn attention, it doesn't really have a leader. It is similar to stuff that Muhammad Ali was doing back in the day, but he would speak to the issues. You need to be able to break through the noise and you need an effective spokesman. Especially now that Trump weighed in, if it becomes just anti-Trump, then get in line.

When Sasse says he wishes they would find a more effective way to protest or bring attention misses the point. Unless the point is do something that he can promptly ignore.