Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[Whitley]

Yates took her lititle stand and was properly fired.

not surprised she got fired. But I think the tone of the WH release was a bit harsh. President Trump fired her there was no need to take a couple petty swipes at her (but then against President Trump is a petty man).

[The Oracle]

Bit harsh? Really childish.

[Whitley]

BTW, the Acting Head of Customs and Immigration has been fired. This is a cabinet level position that does not even have a nominee yet

[SeattleLionsFan]

That was my impression too. News this morning is that 109 people were affected out of 325,000, and the 109 situations have been resolved.

This is a lie. The White Hiuse does nothing but lie to you. Why do you let them play you so bad?

[CGVT]

To the Trumpsters, Trump is Santa Clause to an eight year old. They know he's not real, but they want him to be real so badly that they will suspend belief, facts, and logic to make it so

[iam416]

This is a lie. The White Hiuse does nothing but lie to you. Why do you let them play you so bad?

#muslimban

[iam416]

Bit harsh? Really childish.

Correct. On both sides, of course. Yates, who was obviously on her way out, could have simply resigned rather than nail herself to the cross as a grandstanding insubordinate who wanted her 5 minutes. She got exactly what she had coming.

Her grounds for refusing the enforce the order -- because it wasn't "right" -- I mean...lol. I didn't realize DOJ officials get to pick and choose which laws and orders to enforce based on personal morality.

[hack]

Well on the one hand, you'd think that if this was illegal there would be a law we could check and that should be in the coverage. This shouldn't be one person saying it's legal and one saying it isn't. Go check the law and see what it says. I recognize it isn't always that simple, so we have to have people like talent or Stan or Geezer or SLF on the planet to figure it out and otherwise degrade our collective quality of life, but at least it should be a starting point. I haven't seen a reference to the relevant law here in any of the stories I've read. Then again I've read only two or three. I have a lot of stories to read right now about a lot of things. So maybe that's out there and I haven't seen it.

Then again, once you've got multiple judges weighing in on the legality of something -- or even one -- isn't that it? Courts and judges are there to give us a ruling on what's legal and what's not. We have one now. What's being done is now therefore illegal because the judges have said so, so no point in arguing it past that, right? Maybe Yates was martyring herself or maybe she didn't want to be remembered as someone who enabled an assault on the rule of law. Doesn't matter. What's important is that, as far as I can tell, the President is breaking the law while claiming to do the opposite. As a process-oriented person, talent, I'm not sure how there's another way to read it.

[Mainevent]

I didn't realize DOJ officials get to pick and choose which laws and orders to enforce based on personal morality.

I agree that she probably should have just resigned, she could have made the same stand doing it that way. But saying someone should just follow orders without any moral involvement is a slippery slope. Do we need to start dredging up the examples of historical atrocities committed under such conditions?

[hack]

How history might have been different if Colin Powell as Secretary of State had the courage to say what he thought about invading Iraq.

It's also saying that it's OK for some arms of government to stage theatrics but not others.

[Wild Hoss]

Its always about who's ox is getting gored. Always.

In that spirit, I am looking for a used "Don't Tread On Me" flag, if anybody here has a lead on one. Should be plenty on the market now...I don't mind a little visible wear and tear. Heh.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

[hack]

Might not be EXACTLY what you're looking for but I have a used ``Please Tread On Me'' flag, if that works just as well.

[iam416]

Hack:

I believe Ms. Yates said this:

My responsibility is to ensure that the position of the Department of Justice is not only legally defensible, but is informed by our best view of what the law is after consideration of all the facts. In addition, I am responsible for ensuring that the positions we take in court remain consistent with this institution's solemn obligation to always seek justice and stand for what is right.

As a lawyer, I read that as pretty much conceding the law is legally defensible, but that in her view it ought not be defended.

As far as one judge ruling on the EO goes, no. It's not settled. Nor is it close. The DOJ can appeal to the Circuit Court. Then they can appeal to the Supreme Court. If the Supreme Court declines to hear the case, then the law is only controlling in that Circuit (1 of 12). The DOJ can enforce in other circuits and potentially get favorable rulings.

As you surely recall, a district court judge (more than 1) struck down Obamacare. I don't recall any advocacy that the issue was settled at that point. I recall the appellate process eventually overturning those rulings.

I agree that she probably should have just resigned, she could have made the same stand doing it that way. But saying someone should just follow orders without any moral involvement is a slippery slope. Do we need to start dredging up the examples of historical atrocities committed under such conditions?

If you're going to use the slippery slope argument -- and it's one that I abhor -- then be aware that it goes both fucking ways. If she's justified in not following the order because SHE THINKS it's morally wrong, then what else is she justified in doing? Killing the president!!!!!

C'mon, man. This is pretty clear. You work for the DOJ. You don't like how the DOJ does business, leave. But if stay, do your fucking job. We're not in the same galaxy as carrying out genocide.

[Wild Hoss]

Might not be EXACTLY what you're looking for but I have a used ``Please Tread On Me'' flag, if that works just as well.

Won't your dominatrix coming looking for it?

[Mainevent]

C'mon, man. This is pretty clear. You work for the DOJ. You don't like how the DOJ does business, leave. But if stay, do your fucking job. We're not in the same galaxy as carrying out genocide.

Which is why I agreed that she should have resigned. But I'm glad you'll be here to tell us when it's ok for somebody to take a stand on a moral basis.