Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[Hannibal]

So much nostalgia for the pre-20th century past in this forum, a time when life was brutish and short. But hey, no irritating Pride flags.
!

Pre 20 Century? How about the late 20th Century or the early 21st century? Life wasn't so bad then ya know. Turning the clock back 25 years (governance-wise) would be perfectly fine with me. The centrist positions of 1998 would be Nazi stuff now.

The 19th and 20th centuries were marked with absolutely massive improvements in quality of life and life expectancy in the Western world, and we did it without affirmative action and rainbow flags. We rocketed to the top of Mazlow's hierarchy of needs so that now you and I can debate stuff on machines connected by fiberoptic cables.

Maybe society wasn't broken before the year 2013?

[Dr. Strangelove]

I'm sure Progs would dislike some things in those Marvel books from the 60's and 70's but there's also plenty of liberalism in them that would anger stone age cons like you if such messages were put into children's entertainment today. Stan Lee, Jack Kirby, nearly all those guys from back in those days were big liberals.

[Hannibal]

I'm sure Progs would dislike some things in those Marvel books from the 60's and 70's but there's also plenty of liberalism in them that would anger stone age cons like you if such messages were put into children's entertainment today. Stan Lee, Jack Kirby, nearly all those guys from back in those days were big liberals.

For the Left, "Stone Age" = 1995. Bronze Age was 2010. But it was all Dark Ages until we became enlightened in recent years somehow. Throughout those Dark Ages ignorant scientists thought that sex was determined at conception, but thanks to the contributions great men like John Money*, we now know that it's an arbitrary assessment "assigned at birth".

*if you don't know who John Money is, Google him. He first proposed the concept of "gender". He's the guy that the Left gets their modern views on sexuality from.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Pre 20 Century? How about the late 20th Century or the early 21st century? Life wasn't so bad then ya know. Turning the clock back 25 years (governance-wise) would be perfectly fine with me. The centrist positions of 1998 would be Nazi stuff now.

The 19th and 20th centuries were marked with absolutely massive improvements in quality of life and life expectancy in the Western world, and we did it without affirmative action and rainbow flags. We rocketed to the top of Mazlow's hierarchy of needs so that now you and I can debate stuff on machines connected by fiberoptic cables.

Maybe society wasn't broken before the year 2013?

Liberals (or Progs) think society can be improved somewhat. Conservatives think society's fine the way it is or in some cases needs to reverse course. The eternal struggle. And the goalposts are constantly moving.

25 years ago homosexuality was still illegal in some states (though not aggressively enforced).

[Hannibal]

I don't think that society is fine the way that it is now, and I also see that the people warning us of this Age of Insanity were right all along.

Society has improved over the years via people creating, building, and inventing. Liberalism has been occasionally useful at freeing up obstacles to those goals, but now it is nothing but an impediment. I would be delighted if society progressed to visiting the stars and curing cancer, but that's not the direction that we are going. We aren't progressing. We are simply changing into a woke theocracy -- one that has its own tenets, superstitions, codes of behavior, and taboos.

Since the end of World War II, we have repeatedly jumped head first into all kinds of societal changes that went against thousands of years of tradition and acceptance of how society should operate, not to mention biology. And we did this with little reflection on why society was set up the way that it was. Our ancestors were not all morons of low character, and the secret to positive living was not magically discovered in recent years.

[Hannibal]

With that said, a bizarre Ted Kaczinski admiration cult has emerged on the Right in the past few days. It's loony and I hope that those people never gain power.

[Dr. Strangelove]

The Industrial Revolution arguably upset thousands of years of human civilization more than anything that happened in the 20th century. And I see yokels on Twitter saying things like "The Industrial Revolution was a mistake" and getting approval from Elon. We're in a weird time where more & more people lack perspective. And I'll both sides that.

[Hannibal]

Yes, it's kinda nuts. I haven't noticed Elon retweeting or engaging them though. Do you have any example?

[Dr. Strangelove]

[Mike]

Wouldn't all green progs agree with that? How much carbon pollution can be attributed to the industrial revolution? I bet it's not an insignificant amount!

[Hannibal]

If Elon Musk wants to do his part by stopping the mass mining and refining of the minerals required for our economy to be entirely battery-powered, he's welcome to do so at any time.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Foxhopper, in response to your question, "do you really think Ukraine is winning and is it worth it?" At this point, I don't think either side is winning or losing. It should be pretty clear why I think it is worth it. I've posted numerous opinion posts on why I do think it is worth it and caveated most of them with YMMV. There's plenty of room for debate as to the question of is it worth it? In my world view, it is.

Most western democracies support Ukraine and believe that, in the context beyond that of the waring participants, that the war in Ukraine is representative of a historic battle for influence on the world stage between authoritarianism and liberal democracy; on one hand, you have the current rules based world order and those liberal democratic nations and institutions that assure it's continuation. On the other, you have an axis of authoritarian nations who would replace that world order with a multipolar one with the rules defined by that axis of power.

In a following statement, you allege that, "you love your country but they are fucking things up." I'd want you to be more specific about exactly who "they" are and what you think is getting "fucked up." I think you and I would probably find some agreement on who "they" are and what's getting "fucked up."

[Dr. Strangelove]

Wouldn't all green progs agree with that? How much carbon pollution can be attributed to the industrial revolution? I bet it's not an insignificant amount!

Lol a lot of green progs probably would. That’s why it’s weird seeing a lot of the “New Right” express admiration for the dead bastard.

It reminds me how a lot of Trump weirdos love the Kennedy family because they somehow view them as anti Deep State warriors.

[iam416]

I'll use "progress" to refer to societal changes w/o saying good/bad -- but Mike gets at the other side of DSL's "both sides"-ism. What we think of as conservatives are not necessarily a fan of cultural progress while those on the Left are not necessarily fans of technological progress. I personally find the latter more perplexing as the notions of cheap food (GMOs) and cheap energy (oil/gas) seem like they should be universallly lauded. I mean, I think any country would take cheaper food and cheaper energy if offered. Not every country would take the cultural progress in the US and other certain countries.

But, whatever.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I'll use "progress" to refer to societal changes w/o saying good/bad -- but Mike gets at the other side of DSL's "both sides"-ism. What we think of as conservatives are not necessarily a fan of cultural progress while those on the Left are not necessarily fans of technological progress. I personally find the latter more perplexing as the notions of cheap food (GMOs) and cheap energy (oil/gas) seem like they should be universallly lauded. I mean, I think any country would take cheaper food and cheaper energy if offered. Not every country would take the cultural progress in the US and other certain countries.

But, whatever.

Anti-technology sentiment is rising on the Right but I think you're historically correct. I've made the case before that the Right has largely co-opted the hippy-dippy anti-vaccine and anti-GMO movements. GMOs are how the govt controls you, man!