Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[THE_WIZARD_]

no

[Tom W]

I cannot get over how much air time US news channels are devoting to "The World Says Goodbye to Its Beloved Queen". Day 7 of this and there's at least 5 more days to go? Okey-dokey. A bit uncomfortable with how many Americans seem to yearn for this shit.

There's probably not THAT many. It's more like the networks thinking that people want to watch this nonsense.

Consider yourself fortunate that you weren't in MI when every station covered the ENTIRE Aretha Franklin funeral. The drone coverage of the hearse's 15 mile slow journey to the cemetery was one of the most ridiculous things ever shown on local TV here.

[Jeff Buchanan]

........ indicative of the MSM's failure to separate itself from profit making and responsible journalism. I feel remorse at the death of a Queen Elizabeth II - that's because she was an impressive woman who had an impact throughout her life. I've moved on; obviously the MSM thinks Americans haven't and need to be over-informed wrt the Queen's 9d funeral about related irrelvant shit. The MSM's coverage of it, that chokes off reporting on several important and sustantive national and international stories, is ridiculous.

[Da Geezer]

JB:

I read the article from the Guardian that you posted, and I'd like you to give me a definition of what democracy is and what fascism is.

The article doesn't define either term.

I believe that when Ds talk of democracy, they mean the idea that every human in the country is entitled to vote and any limitation is a "threat to democracy". I further believe that the Ds use the word fascism synonymously with the phrase "conservative nationalist". I'm not sure there is even such a thing as a progressive nationalist!

The D point of view about Trump is that he is some sort of nationalist which makes him a fascist.

But the Ds never point out the actual line of demarcation that makes anyone a fascist or a communist. That is the belief that the government should be in charge of everything. The ONLY significant distinction between fascism and communism (socialism) is that under fascism there is private ownership of the "commanding heights" of the economy and under communism, the government owns the means of production. That is it. The Krupp family claimed titular ownership of their factories under the fascist Nazis. The CCP owns the companies we associate with Jack Ma.

What all this discussion comes down to is whether you believe government control is a good thing or a bad thing. The FBI raided the homes of several R operatives two days ago and surrounded Mike Lyndel at a Hardee's drive-in yesterday to take his phone. We are well on the way to making dissent illegal or at least very expensive. IMO, the authoritarian government we now HAVE is a bigger issue than even the present world order v. the authoritarian world order. We have nothing if we cannot speak freely.

What no one has ever explained to me is why Trump in Mar-Jun of 2020 didn't declare a national emergency and impose something akin to martial law. I believe he could have gotten away with that. No more Cuomo "needing" 40,000 ventilators. Why did this authoritarian choose to keep in place all of the separations of powers and republican government that could have been done away with? Think what this authoritarian could have done to "drain the swamp" with martial law.

[Tom W]

JB:

What no one has ever explained to me is why Trump in Mar-Jun of 2020 didn't declare a national emergency and impose something akin to martial law. I believe he could have gotten away with that. No more Cuomo "needing" 40,000 ventilators. Why did this authoritarian choose to keep in place all of the separations of powers and republican government that could have been done away with? Think what this authoritarian could have done to "drain the swamp" with martial law.

Maybe because, even though he's a pompous con man and cockholster, Trump actually did the right thing. Or, maybe he just didn't need to. Characters like Cuomo and Whitmer did a pretty good job of imposing a quasi martial law.

[Dr. Strangelove]

I submit it's less that Trump liked to do the "right thing" and more that, like all bullies, he's a coward at heart. And terrified of being humiliated in public.

[Dr. Strangelove]

JB:


What all this discussion comes down to is whether you believe government control is a good thing or a bad thing. The FBI raided the homes of several R operatives two days ago and surrounded Mike Lyndel at a Hardee's drive-in yesterday to take his phone. We are well on the way to making dissent illegal or at least very expensive. IMO, the authoritarian government we now HAVE is a bigger issue than even the present world order v. the authoritarian world order. We have nothing if we cannot speak freely.

We don't yet know what the FBI wants with Mike Lindell at this point but it's possible that is has something to do with the fact that he's been involved in the theft of election equipment and data in multiple states? At a minimum he was involved in the Tina Peters theft in Colorado and possibly similar illegal access to machines in both Michigan and Georgia.

The 30-40 Trump associates who got served subpoenas are all connected to either the Fake Electors scheme or Trump's potentially fraudulent fundraising in the months immediately after the election. He raised over $100M promising it would all go to fighting the election results and virtually none of it did. Likewise he has done absolutely nothing to financially help any of the Jan 6th defendants, the so-called "political prisoners", something a lot of the far right crazies are even pointing out.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Anyways here's Pillow Man this morning brimming with confidence. The last few seconds is awkward silence of Mike possibly reflecting on what his life has become.

[Jeff Buchanan]

I read the article from the Guardian that you posted, and I'd like you to give me a definition of what democracy is and what fascism is.

It depends on who you read about these two terms and how historians explain the rise and existance of either. I find your question to be an academic one. I'll try to answer it.

My read on the Guradian article is that it's author, in reviewing Madelin Albright's book on fascism, wanted to demean the book and the "suppositions" Albright makes about fascism to support her definition of it...... a liberal castigating a conservative over the definition of fascism she established in her book and the threat it posed to democracy. Albright definately sees DJT as a threat to democracy with the characteristics that history has assigned to the term fascist......one woman's opinion, over-the top as it may be - and the author tries to undermine it's validity.

The most striking argument the author puts forward is that Hitler was not a fascist (see the article to understand why not). He was an ultra-nationalist. I don't think it makes a lot of difference. Both of these political movments - Nazism and Facism - have similar features. Both are anti-democratic liberalism (I know you understand those terms put together). Both contain elements of racism. I see some of DJT's behavior following the 2020 election as anti-democratic (add liberalism at your discretion). I do not think that DJT himself, along with his reasonable MAGA supporters would desribe DJT as a facsist as Madeline Albright defines that term or an ultra-nationalist by the definition the author of the Guradian article assigns to Adolph Hitler ..... and we both know there are unreasonable people that have done just that.

Still, on the global political stage, there are rising nationalist themes, none to the extremes Hitler or Mussolini took them (yet, IMO) that with a trend to ultra-nationalism can and will be a real threat to liberal democracy. I think the axis of the political leaders of Russia, China, Iran and NK both taken indpendently or acting together are a real threat to liberal democracy and it is a fundamental reason why I think we should be supporting Ukraine, SK. Taiwan and Israel.

I think what you may be taking issue with is the part of my post at the end of it that begins, "Madeline Albright wrote a book...." and ends with "the article linked to below that does a great job of making the distinction between facism and ultra-nationalism." Well, maybe you are right and it doesn't but back to my point above, does it matter? Both are threats to liberal democracy and I'm pretty sure you and I would agree on the defintion of liberal democracy and all that term implies. I know there are reasonable people who do not believe these political movements are threats. I'd disagree with them and have right here in this forum thread.

[Da Geezer]

Maybe because, even though he's a pompous con man and cockholster, Trump actually did the right thing. Or, maybe he just didn't need to. Characters like Cuomo and Whitmer did a pretty good job of imposing a quasi martial law.

You are missing my point. If Trump is a fascist and an authoritarian, why did he go to great lengths to maintain republican government? No question he is a horrible person. But look at his actions, not his Twitter feeds. He had a perfect excuse to declare martial law and make changes in the bureaucracy that the Rs wanted. Trump's ACTIONS were indistinguishable from that of the most reasonable conservative. I didn't vote for him in 2016, but his actions as President were generally good with the exception of taking Fauci's idea of shutting down the economy.

[THE_WIZARD_]

Quid quo pro Joe is a saint...as is his son...

[Tom W]

No, I think we're on the same page here. I think we agree that there's plenty to find wrong with Trump, but being a fascist or an authoritarian are those pieces of shit that don't stick to the walls.

[THE_WIZARD_]

It's all the Dems have.

MAGA!!!!!

JAN 6TH!!!!!

DEMOCRACY IN PERIL!!!!

JIM CROW ON STEROIDS!!!!!

[Dr. Strangelove]

On the lighter side of crazy ass Trumpers

Trump Fan in Clown Wig Threatens to Kill All Democrats in a Dairy Queen (vice.com)

[THE_WIZARD_]

Hey I needed a butterfinger blizzard...