Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[Jeff Buchanan]

149 covid deaths in California reported today. 105 in Texas. Both are single-day records for each state. There is still some hope or reason to think this could be delayed reporting from a holiday weekend but we'll see. They may have begun to spike.

They're rising, not spiking. I know, nit-picking.

Deaths increased on a week on week basis in FL and of course, the press is all over this. I don't think you can separate trends for increased cases, increased hospitalizations and increased deaths. More old people are going to die nationally as time goes on. Regionally, it's a different story.

Desantis made an excellent case today for how FL has dampened deaths in the vulnerable population by age by taking steps to control what is going on in LTC facilities compared to other states, NY in particular, Michigan and NJ as well. He states that the vulnerability of this segment of FL's population was identified at the outset of the pandemic in FL, deliberate steps taken and the death rate among that population in FL is around 6%. Nationally, the over 65 population makes up 8 of every 10 deaths (80%).

He did acknowledge increasing new cases and called them concerning, especially S. FL's, and being addressed. We'd like to get the % positives down but not at the expense of closing things down again, he said. He thinks the current situation is manageable ...... if people will be responsible. If your old, protect yourself. If your young, respect the vulnerable by your actions.

Desantis has steadfastly supported FL's economy over shuttering. I think in the end, when all of this is history and it is reviewed in retrospect, as new cases increased with reopening, calling the risks of serious consequences from COVID not as great as the risks to the state's economy by re-shuttering to control the virus spread will be shown to be the correct position to take. Desantis also said, schools need to open. His guidance is that schools must offer 5ds of in class instruction but alternatively, other options can be offered to parents who determine the risk is too high to send their kids to school. He also pointed to the statistically low risk of C-19 complications for school aged kids. The worry, he added, that kids infecting staff or coming home from school, infected, and passing it to family members is unfounded. He said adults pass more COVID to kids than the other way around - I had not heard that. I'll check it out. Desantis added if we can do drive through restaurants, restaurants in general, Home Depot and the like, we can do schools. He is absolutely right.

During his presser today in Jacksonville, the US Secretary of Labor attended. The main theme of his comments ticked off the jobs created in FL by opening and staying open. He said the biggest concern of the US Labor Department was jobs lost to low income wage earners and the importance of opening sectors of the economy that employed them, which, of course, FL is doing. It was nice to hear upbeat comments instead of the doom and gloom coming from just about every corner.

[Dr. Strangelove]

[Dr. Strangelove]

I really don't get why Trump hasn't switched gears on this yet. Makes me wonder if most people in his bubble are just lying to him about how 'well' he is doing in order to keep their jobs for a few more miserable months.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/broad-disapproval-trumps-handling-coronavirus-race-relations-poll/story?id=71704889

[CGVT]

Mobile and Baldwin Counties in Alabama just announce their school reopening plans and a local news station (a Sinclair station with a very conservative slant, BTW) took a poll. They will have a choice between virtual and on campus classes. This is a very small samples size, I know, but the breakdown surprised me. If the lack of masks and social distancing when I am out and about were any indication, I would have expected the majority of people would be sending their kids to school, although I expect the most of the unsure will be sending them to school when the time comes and that would eve thing up some?


Screenshot 2020-07-10 at 7.48.34 AM.png

[Ghengis Jon]

Jeff, you gone down the covid T cell rabbit hole yet?


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN24B1D8

[iam416]

Democrats are getting what they want in NYC -- the police there are fleeing toward retirement so much so that they have to limit the number that can put in for retirment -- https://nypost.com/2020/07/08/nypd-l...rge-this-week/

It's a wet dream to see the police self-abolish. NYC is on track toward utopia.

Meanwhile, shootings in NYC are skyrocketing. But, there's nothing to see there.

[iam416]

Meanwhile, if you support Rs you, quite literally, must be boycotted -- https://www.nationalreview.com/news/...praises-trump/

DSL-favorite Julian Castro and Jon-favorite AOC demand boycott of Goya because CEO visited Rose Garden and said nice things about PDJT. The CEO was there in support of PDJT's Hispanic Poverty Initiative.

That's the logical end and GOAL of the cancel culture which so many deny is even happening. The goal is, quite obviously, to silence anyone who supports conservatives or Rs. I mean, it REALLY IS THAT SIMPLE.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Goya Oh Boya!

[Dr. Strangelove]

Court does Erdogan's bidding. The Hagia Sophia's status as a museum is over and it'll be returned to being a mosque. Part of Erdogan's destruction of the secular state created by Ataturk

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/istanbul-s-hagia-sophia-set-be-converted-mosque-top-court-n1233310

[iam416]

Destroying artistic works seems to be all the rage.

[Hannibal]

Mobile and Baldwin Counties in Alabama just announce their school reopening plans and a local news station (a Sinclair station with a very conservative slant, BTW) took a poll. They will have a choice between virtual and on campus classes. This is a very small samples size, I know, but the breakdown surprised me. If the lack of masks and social distancing when I am out and about were any indication, I would have expected the majority of people would be sending their kids to school, although I expect the most of the unsure will be sending them to school when the time comes and that would eve thing up some?


Screenshot 2020-07-10 at 7.48.34 AM.png

That question is framed poorly. It should be framed as "do you want school with Covid or do you want zero school?", because home learning isn't going to work for any but a very small portion of the kids. Most kids younger than college-age will learn jack shit on the year. You might as well just cancel the year and postpone high school graduation for everybody.

And let's reexamine the facts. Covid-19 is less harmful to school age children and the majority of the adults that will be in schools than the seasonal flu. We have more than enough data that shows this. We had more than enough data that showed this back in March. It would make more sense to shut down schools to protect kids and teachers from the seasonal flu than for Covid-19.

The calculus at work -- the real calculus at work -- is whether to cancel the school year in order to protect the highly vulnerable 70+ population from catching the disease from children and grandchildren that caught it at school. That's it. For me, the ethical equation on that calculus is simple -- fuck that. Open the schools and do whatever it takes to protect the elderly, but accept the risk. We're talking about kids' lives and future livelihoods here.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Jeff, you gone down the covid T cell rabbit hole yet?


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN24B1D8

Yes ...... but, the T-Cell response is simply part of the overall cascade of responses from the body's adaptive and innate immune systems when a virus is present. Immunology is a complex subject. I know some but am no expert.

I do know that T-Cells originate in the Thymus. They circulate in the blood and hang around in lymph nodes waiting to be presented with a virus. Once presented with a new antigen (no immunity exists as in SARS-CoV-2), a chain of events occurs to rid the body of the virus. In that process some of the T-cells become memory T-cells. These allow the body to react more quickly when re-exposed to the same virus ...... that's "innate immunity."

But wait, there's more ....... the innate immune system also develops anti-bodies. You guessed it, IgG and IgM. Scientist believe that everyone develops a T-cell response to SARS-CoV-2 but also believe that not everyone develops IgG or IgM ABs. Hence questions arise about the utility of AB testing to confirm previous infection.

Ideally, drugs or vaccines would produce both an AB and T-Cell response to the virus. The article you linked to describes scientists finding a more robust T-Cell response that looks like it is more permanent than what has been described as a fleeting IgG, IgM response. That begs the question, well, how immune can we actually be to the disease impact of C-19 over time. I don't think this is anything new or startling. As journalists who write on health and science issues become more knowledgeable about the virus and therapeutics, they write about them. But this stuff is immunology 101.

As an aside, because I do know a bit about HIV..... of course, no vaccine has been developed to produce immunity. OTH, a ton has been accomplished with anti-retroviral therapeutics. These drugs are so effective that even though HIV infection may be confirmed in an individual, the disease impact can be zero. If the patient takes the various classes of medications that suppress viral replication this therapy allows T-Cell immunity to be restored. HIV attacks and kills T-Cells making such infected persons develop AIDS and become susceptible to host of diseases that ultimately kill them. Today, compliant HIV patients don't die and live normal lives with completely competent T-cell function and normal immune response to other diseases. I can see a similar approach to successfully managing the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic.

[lineygoblue]

I don't want my grandson going to ANY day care or school right now. Those places are petri dishes for just about every kind of illness that is out there right now. When our grandson was going to day care 2 days per week, it seems like he always had a cough and sniffles. Since he's been kept home, he's had none of that. Fortunately my son and his wife work for employers who have allowed them to work from home, and its worked out for them. When and if they resume going back to their offices, we will watch our grandson as much as necessary, to keep him out of day care.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Liney ...... illnesses from day-care, school, any place where under 10s gather is a "petri dish" of germs. Kids don't develop competent immune systems until they are around 10, some a bit earlier depending on level of exposure.

If you're worried about COVID, the risk is very low in this age group and it's not the kids transmitting disease to adults when they come home, it's the other way around. Adults give it to the kids, kids do pass it among themselves but these guys aren't super spreaders if the spread at all. If they do spread COVID, it is without significant consequence.

Sure, you can prevent your grandson from getting sick by keeping him home but he is losing out on learning, socializing and interaction and after you keep him home, as soon as he goes out and about, he's much more likely to get walloped with something than if you let him attend a quality day care setting or school.

My daughters, with kids ranging from infancy to 13, even in the setting of COVID, have no issues with day-care or in school learning for the reasons above. The do select carefully. All of them are in the medical fields.

It's a personal choice. I just want you to go in armed with the facts. Downsides are greater than upsides of keeping kids in a bubble.

[CGVT]

My 17 year old is going to school and my daughter is going back to NYU next month. There is risk in all things in life. A person has to do what they can to mitigate that risk and decide what risk is acceptable. We’ll see how it shakes out