Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

[Dr. Strangelove]

Also when the NFL ordered the players out of the locker rooms after 9/11 in order to wrap itself in the flag and patriotism, that too was a political act. Conservatives didn't complain

[THE_WIZARD_]

Disrespect our flag...and Rocky will kick your ass...

[THE_WIZARD_]

The fact that you are allowed to post here is an abomination DSL...stfu for fuck sake...

[whodean]

Miscellaneous And Off Topic Subjects

I support freedom of speech, there players can do this if they want. That said I feel it's in very poor taste the way they are politicizing the national anthem. There should be a better way to criticize inequality than to disrespect the very symbol of our country.

Now Trump saying his shit was just plain stupid. He is a divider. I lololol at what happened yesterday as anti-Trump than anti-America.

[iam416]

Do you think they are protesting for a phantom reason?

This is the nub of it. The act is whatever, but for MOST people it's the underlying reason of the protest. Sure, there are some folks out there who are either (a) it's kosher for anyone to do it; or (b) it's never kosher.

But, for the bulk it's the actual subject matter. Put another way, if Chris Long decided he was going to kneel during the anthem to protect any of, e.g. (a) illegal immigration and amnesty; (b) too high a tax burden; (c) affirmative action; (d) BLM or (e) a shit-ton more, then the sides would be almost entirely flipped.

If someone wants to make a political statement, that's all well and good. But you're accountable. Period. If you want to enter into that arena then don't expect people who disagree with you to just simply nod and say, "yeah, man, respect your right to say whatever." It sure as shit didn't happen to to poor Google guy who was fired post haste. It sure as shit didn't happen to the Mozilla exec who gave money to the California "traditional marriage" referendum. And it sure as shit wouldn't happen to any player taking any of the positions I mentioned above.

But, the bottom line is own your shit. Be fucking accountable. There's a reason I would never circulate my political opinions in a private (or public) company. I know that I'll incur risk for doing so. Especially if, e.g., I want to tackle the total Obama Title IX horseshit or the farcical "diversity" rationales. So I don't.

The fundamental issue with the NFL not the method of protest, but the fundamental disagreement on the underlying issue. That, and Kaepernick is a fucking tool. He called HRC a racist has an avowed love for Castro. So, I mean, beyond his kneeling shit, I think he is a bit wacko.

[Da Geezer]

Undocumented immigrants are already barred from recieving federal benefits.

Yes, and employers are barred from paying illegals $ 5.00 less per hour, but it happens. What the law "says" and the way it is enforced are two different things. Illegal immigration is a crime, but Obama chose not to enforce the law as written. As Talent says, I doubt if there can be any real argument as to whether illegals use social services and welfare, just as there can be little doubt that employers pay less wages and benefits to illegals. AA basically said "enforce the law, increase the penalties..." and that should go on both sides of the employer/employee relationship.

What are people's thoughts on Trump taking on the NFL/NBA out of the blue over the past few days?

I think it is Trump's biggest political mistake since June of 2015. He should have just let the "protest" movement run its course.

[froot loops]

It may cost fans, ratings and money, isn't that the point of protesting? They are putting their livelihood at risk to bring attention to something they feel is not getting substantial redress. The President of the United States calling a protester a son of a bitch is out of line. It's ridiculous really. The Justice Department report on Ferguson and the surrounding communities was a hell of a lot more outrageous than some NFL players kneeling.

[Wild Hoss]

Yay...more flag outrage. Because that's important.

Squirrel!

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

[iam416]

Also, to deal with this "should the anthem be played" canard. Look, it IS. I happen to like it. I think I actually ONLY hear it at games and I always take time to reflect and the little memories that come to mind usually surprise me. None of those memories are political. It takes a massive leap to call it political in any real sense of the word. Political as in respecting our country is political. Alright. Whatever. That sort of suggests a political movement that doesn't -- the Progs???

Now, it's not as emotional, for me, as hearing Carmen Ohio. Heh.

[iam416]

AA basically said "enforce the law, increase the penalties..." and that should go on both sides of the employer/employee relationship.

Yeah, there needs to be a total dissuasion to hire illegals. Right now the fines are such that it's well worth the risk. I mean, if you're ACTUALLY concerned about it.

[froot loops]

This is the nub of it. The act is whatever, but for MOST people it's the underlying reason of the protest. Sure, there are some folks out there who are either (a) it's kosher for anyone to do it; or (b) it's never kosher.

But, for the bulk it's the actual subject matter. Put another way, if Chris Long decided he was going to kneel during the anthem to protect any of, e.g. (a) illegal immigration and amnesty; (b) too high a tax burden; (c) affirmative action; (d) BLM or (e) a shit-ton more, then the sides would be almost entirely flipped.

If someone wants to make a political statement, that's all well and good. But you're accountable. Period. If you want to enter into that arena then don't expect people who disagree with you to just simply nod and say, "yeah, man, respect your right to say whatever." It sure as shit didn't happen to to poor Google guy who was fired post haste. It sure as shit didn't happen to the Mozilla exec who gave money to the California "traditional marriage" referendum. And it sure as shit wouldn't happen to any player taking any of the positions I mentioned above.

But, the bottom line is own your shit. Be fucking accountable. There's a reason I would never circulate my political opinions in a private (or public) company. I know that I'll incur risk for doing so. Especially if, e.g., I want to tackle the total Obama Title IX horseshit or the farcical "diversity" rationales. So I don't.

The fundamental issue with the NFL not the method of protest, but the fundamental disagreement on the underlying issue. That, and Kaepernick is a fucking tool. He called HRC a racist has an avowed love for Castro. So, I mean, beyond his kneeling shit, I think he is a bit wacko.

I'm pretty sure Kaepernick is being held accountable.

In regards to the tax scenario you offered, it isn't kneeling but many high profile athletes have skipped the White House invitation because they are die hard Republicans the Fox News crowd would celebrate that. A black guy like Curry, he's ungrateful.

[iam416]

I'm pretty sure Kaepernick is being held accountable.

Indeed. And good. I guess I didn't finish my point (or thought it implied) -- don't be upset when people are held accountable (generally, not specifically you -- I have no clue if you are about CK). But, man, a healthy majority are.

In regards to the tax scenario you offered, it isn't kneeling but many high profile athletes have skipped the White House invitation because they are die hard Republicans the Fox News crowd would celebrate that. A black guy like Curry, he's ungrateful.

Yeah, I mean, are we really going to go back and forth with examples of how each side shits on the other? I have hundreds at my fingertips, man.

[Dr. Strangelove]

Also, to deal with this "should the anthem be played" canard. Look, it IS. I happen to like it. I think I actually ONLY hear it at games and I always take time to reflect and the little memories that come to mind usually surprise me. None of those memories are political. It takes a massive leap to call it political in any real sense of the word. Political is in respecting our country is political. Alright. Whatever.

Now, it's not as emotional, for me, as hearing Carmen Ohio. Heh.

It's an appeal to patriotism. Appeals to patriotism are NOT apolitical in my mind. It's an insertion of politics and nationalism into an apolitical event. I'm not saying that's appalling or anything like that. As a group we face strong social and peer pressure to stand, remove your hats, be 'respectful', and sing along as we praise our nation. To me that's political, but I can see disagreement.

Maybe the original reasons have been lost over time and it's now so much tradition that it's lost meaning to most people. But I believe the tradition began during WWI at baseball games to rally people's support for the War. It stuck afterwards.

[Da Geezer]

" .... lesson I'm taking from Burn's piece is that America better fully understand the situation on the ground where military intervention is being considered and all of the implications of undertaking it.

You silence voices of protest and discontent in America and you risk repeating the costly mistakes in lives and treasure that the US has made in SEA and the Gulf.

True enough, but last night's episode on the Tet offensive (and mini-Tet) was spot on. 58,000 VC/NVA casualties in Tet and 38,000 more in mini-Tet, but all that was reported was what a whipping the US was taking. The news media's role in turning public opinion was crucial.

What comes through in the whole series though is that, from JFK on, decisions about the war were invariably made for domestic political reasons. Burns proves that the DOD and LBJ knew that the war was unwinnable no later than 1965.

[iam416]

Maybe the original reasons have been lost over time and it's now so much tradition that it's lost meaning to most people. But I believe the tradition began during WWI at baseball games to rally people's support for the War. It stuck afterwards.

I definitely agree with the first point, and I think you're correct for the second.

I mean, sure -- it CAN be political, especially in times of war and especially a controversial war. Currently, though, it's probably rote for most. As I said, which party is against respectfully acknowledging America? Heh.

So, thanks for flushing that out a bit. Can be political; don't think it is now or has been for awhile.