Michigan 29, Indian 7 - Post Game Thread

[Mike]

I think we’ll beat PSU. Or at least have a very good shot at doing so. I’m just going back to my peaceful ambivalence and focusing on hockey and basketball.

I still can’t think of one shining moment during Harbaugh’s 7 years. I guess the Citrus Bowl win his first year. But I need to use all my fingers and some toes to count the number of gut-wrenching, mind-numbing losses in important games.

[lineygoblue]

Even in losing to OSU, I think PSU resurrected itself a bit. Probably enough to beat Michigan in its next "white out". And I'm sure the officiating crew will have funny and entertaining ways to interpret their replays to assist in that outcome.

The Big Ten East is down to MSU and OSU now. They are the only teams that control their own destiny.

[Jeff Buchanan]

I think we’ll beat PSU. Or at least have a very good shot at doing so. I’m just going back to my peaceful ambivalence and focusing on hockey and basketball.

I still can’t think of one shining moment during Harbaugh’s 7 years. I guess the Citrus Bowl win his first year. But I need to use all my fingers and some toes to count the number of gut-wrenching, mind-numbing losses in important games.

Well, that's a start. None of us here went into this season thinking this team would be any better than Harbaugh's 6 other teams - mostly not good and tended to collapse or give up. After the first three games the recurrent theme was, "we've seen this act before." After a shaky win v. Rutgers in AA doubters held fast. Then came road wins at Madison and a gritty victory v. Neb in Lincoln, doubters started changing lanes with some, nay a lot of fans, thinking this could be a good team. They destroyed a bad NfW team as a tune-up for MSY in EL. That didn't go well. Fans that thought this was a good team resumed being doubters and called forth, like you did, all sorts of bad things Harbaugh is blamed for, some of them completely justifiable.

The team is as good, and I've opined is probably better than, it was before losing a close game in EL I think the doom-saying is grossly overdone. Doubters have pasted a big L, signifying looser, on every coaches cap and every players helmet. That's just wrong. Let's see how this plays out. The road just got harder but the goals are still in reach.

[lineygoblue]

From another thread:

I already know what Linesman will say, "Ward won't fire him."

Harbaugh is probably going to go 9-3, and with some luck he may even go 10-2. How do you fire him for that?

[Mike]

From another thread:



Harbaugh is probably going to go 9-3, and with some luck he may even go 10-2. How do you fire him for that?

Because he loses all the important ones and always does. 7 years and he will have finished higher than 3rd in the BTE exactly once.

[lineygoblue]

Because he loses all the important ones and always does. 7 years and he will have finished higher than 3rd in the BTE exactly once.

Oh, I'm with you, Mike. I thought Manuel should have cut the cord last year, and at least we'd be midway thru a real rebuilding season.

Instead, the rebuild gets put off another year while Harbaugh keeps trying to get the pig to hold still while applies the lipstick

[Mike]

Yep.

[Jeff Buchanan]

It's pretty much common knowledge that IU starter Michael Penix Jr. and backup Jack Tuttle are both injured and unlikely to play. There’s a chance freshman Donaven McCulley could get the start. I seem to recall a frosh QB started against M in West Lafayette and M lost. Anyone?

A couple of key players back this year for the Hoosiers: tight end Peyton Hendershot and receiver Ty Fryfogle, who seems to have been on the IU roster since M played IU in 2000, Fryfogle had seven catches for 142 yards receiving against Michigan last season, along with all-Big Ten linebacker Micah McFadden. I don't think IU has much of a chance to win in AA. The last probability I saw was M with a 92% win probability. That might have gone down a bit after the MSU loss but I doubt it. M Players cannot allow themselves to read press clippings of themselves. I'm hoping for a pissed off team looking for blood and aggressive coaching that produces a blow-out win. Fuck not embarrassing Tom Allen and the IU players. Allen in particular deserves for his team to be served up a shut the fuck up beat down.

Apparently, the players had a "players only" meeting on Sunday. Talk is cheap but players and coaches, just reading between the lines in post loss interviews on Monday, seem to be pretty refocused on achieving the same goals set at the beginning of the season. They are technically still achievable but M is not in control of their own destiny

[Tom W]

It's pretty much common knowledge that IU starter Michael Penix Jr. and backup Jack Tuttle are both injured and unlikely to play. There’s a chance freshman Donaven McCulley could get the start. I seem to recall a frosh QB started against M in West Lafayette and M lost. Anyone?

That was an ugly mess in the brutal first year of RichRod. That team was completely lost. It showed as they wandered around and off the field. Those of us there gave them shit for it. It was shameful and among the least proud moments I've had as a Michigan fan.

In reality, though, it's among the most stupid of all the Stupid Stats. Of course, you know that - but it had to be brought up.

There's a bit too much doomsaying going on right now. Yeah, losing to Sparty sucks. How this happened does reveal fundamental flaws in where this program is headed. But it looked a lot more like that Texas Rose Bowl loss than it does like some of the shitshows that we've seen in the last 14 seasons.

Let's recall that this nobody (who wasn't smartassing) predicted that this was at ABSOLUTE best an 8-4 team.
It's pretty clear that this is not a shitshow sort of team.

That said, IU is most likely going to be in a world of trouble come saturday night. I'll say a 42-14 sort of trouble.

[Jeff Buchanan]

The UFR MSU was posted this morning. I know posters here aren't interested in "why M lost to MSU" or a litany of excuses and/or apologies for bad preparation by the coaching staff, bad in-game decision making and terrible officiating. So, I'll limit this post to trying to assess the M defense and what we know about it post MSU to the IU game. I've also read the FFFF IU offense post a day ago and will include takes from that.

IU runs a full spread offense, equipped with a QB run game, three and four receivers wide, and never going under center. They haven't appeared to run tempo hiking the ball with 10-15 seconds on the play clock. They will in this game and have likely been practicing the shit out of it. They'll be starting a Freshman QB who had a good game v. Maryland's shitty D. He hit one bomb to Fryfogle, a 52 yarder, but the coaching staff doesn't trust him to pass. His primary threat is to run and he does that more than Pinnix ever did. The Hoosier OL isn't great and against Maryland didn't get much push. M's DL should perform well getting a lot of pressure on McCulley without blitzing.

MSU looked like they planned to exploit known weaknesses in M's DTs. McDonald tried to limit what he perceived as the kind of damage KWIII would wreak between the tackles by putting 6 guys on the LOS (a 6-1 front end).... and how did that go? The problem there was once KWIII broke through what one would usually call the A gaps, there wasn't anyone past the LOS to immediately impede his progress and allow S help to limit big plays. Something else MSU did was confuse the one LB and SS back there by OL blocking scheme designed to hide where KWIII was going to run. It worked (I'll spare the details). In that McDonald has LBs aggressively filling, exploiting that M trend turned out to be an excellent move by MSU. MSU tried to edge M. That didn't work and they didn't need to do it.

In contrast, IU will work the edges. They'll fail at that for the same reasons MSU didn't keep trying it - M is good at defending the edges. IU doesn't have the muscle on their OL to do what MSU did to M's DL and IU doesn't have KWIII. I look for M to keep IU from under 100 yards rushing. To facilitate that, you won't see 6 man fronts and one LB from McDonald v. IU. I'll just make one soft comment about McDonald substitutions. M's DTs don't need to be subbed on every play. Hinton and Smith need to stay on the field and seem to benefit from this when they do. If subbing continues at the pace it did for the MSU game, it means no lessons were learned if and when an opponent's offense runs tempo. That is a very bad sign and means that M's penchant for approaching a game with the attitude we're better than you, will play like we want to, beat us if you can, persists. This is, IMO, all Harbaugh.

M's back end has been surprisingly good and MSU really didn't test it and when they did, vertical routes were covered forcing Thorne, usually under pressure, to check down to shorter routes. McCulley of IU is going to face the same pressures. If Allen changes course and has him throwing a bunch, M's D will get some sacks, a lot of pressures and probably an INT or two. The trend (if you can say that after one start) for IU has been to have McCulley run more than he passes. He has the athleticism and size to be successful at it. At this point he's not adjusted to the speed of the college game and doesn't see or anticipate running lanes opening up. I believe McDonald's approach to spread offenses with a run threat from the QB has been decent. The 4-3-4, C1 hi with Hutchinson and Ajabo at DE , Ross at LB and Hawkins or Hill filling have contained QB runs pretty well. In that this will be IU's approach, M's D should be effective at containing McCulley's run game. Expect the DL to get held. That the BT refs aren't calling this has become a known thing. The degree of it is affecting play-by-play outcomes in an outsized way. It may happen v. IU giving them more positive plays than they would otherwise get if OL weren't aloud to tackle and wrestle an opponent's DL to the ground.

This game favors M heavily and the Wolverines are -20.5. In the aftermath of the MSU loss, the tendency of M to play down to inferior opponents and JH's penchant to do only what is necessary to get and hold a lead, often no matter how small, M will remain terrible ATS.

M34, IU17 in a miserably cold, uninteresting football game that will likely see a large number of empty seats.

[AlabamAlum]

Losing to Michigan State was tough. It’s a rivalry game and I truly believe the Wolverines are a better team and gave the game away with some questionable play calls and some lackluster adjustments (the mistakes by the officiating crew is just part of the game that you have to play through).

That said, I still think Michigan is very good and has a lot to play for. I would also offer that Nick Saban (arguably the greatest college coach of our generation) is in his 26th season as a head coach. Out of those 26 years, he’s only had 2 undefeated seasons. So, in short, don’t give up just yet. You guys have a lot to play for, still, and will take the Cudgel of Vengeance to the Hapless Hoosiers Saturday.

M 38, IU 10

[THE_WIZARD_]

STFU

[THE_WIZARD_]

Saban was beaten mercilessly by Osborne. Twice.

[AlabamAlum]

Wrong thread, Wiz. If your post isn’t at least ostensibly about Michigan-IU, I may have to use my powers as Super Mod to ban you.

Move it to the SEC thread.

[THE_WIZARD_]

Sorry.

Lee Corso whilst at IU...who plays Michigan this week...was beaten mercilessly by Osborne. Twice. As was Nick Saban.

Better?