Michigan Football, Team 140, 2019 Season

[THE_WIZARD_]

shaddup

[Jeff Buchanan]

On a Harbaugh having already reached a recruiting ceiling ......

Dunno, Bronxblue, in his mgo article, suggests the Michigan culture as it relates to its impact on recruiting or the way Harbaugh goes about recruiting won't very likely change. I agree with this ......

So, lets assume this stays the same and I'm not sure I see any significant differences between the way Dabo, Lord Saban or ufm recruit(ed) and Harbaugh's approach. All these programs have equal resources and equal focus. I think the most significant difference that is going to get talented HS players to take serious looks at M is M winning and winning big, not just beating the teams it should beat.

I don't think it is a secret that once a talented HS player starts playing at a particular program, winning garners exposure, exposure garners NFL scouting/recognition, great PFF scores obtained by talented players getting a lot of exposure garners huge pay-offs from the NFL. Kids are going to look at this.

Where has M been? On the fringes with huge, deflating season ending losses, shitty bowls, bowl losses to good teams and in the last two bowls against Usc and UF, players and coaches that were as disinterested as any other post season games I've watched in a lot of watching M football. That has to affect star players M is recruited/has offered where M is competing for their signatures on the LOI with other programs, those programs garnering more visibility and/or other factors are at play - e.g., relationships, close to home, etc. IMO, give Harbaugh/M that winner's edge, sustain it and they'll start stock piling talent very much like Clemson, Alabama and osu.

[hack]

There are things Michigan can't have, like weather and proximity to the southern belt's talent, and things Michigan won't do. That puts a lower ceiling on recruiting vis-a-vis the teams that do it at an elite level. But there's room to improve by winning the big games. We've seen recruits decommit in the aftermath of big losses.

[froot loops]

I just know some of the stories I've heard about Harbaugh recruiting doesn't jibe with what I know about Saban. I think they are much better than him at it, he's a quirky dude that turns people off. Saban and Meyer could sell snow to an Eskimo.

[hack]

Sounds reasonable. He is definitely quirky and that's not always an asset.

[WM Wolverine]

I don't expect Harbaugh to land a handful of five stars, he's no Dabo, Saban, or Urban... Still I think M should be winning battles for top 100 players more often. He has to win the B1G, and/or play in the CFP for that to happen. To win the B1G, you have to beat the Buckeyes and Harbaugh hasn't...

Losing your last two games of the season is really deflating, takes what could've been a very good season into a mediocre one.

[Tom W]

Regarding the Bo comparisons.. Bo's legacy was largely based on (obsessively) building teams to take on Woody's ohio teams. He was always prepared for that game. It was largely successful, but proved surprisingly vulnerable when they ran up against teams that a different style of game or when the occasional fire popped up in the steaming piles of garbage that was the little 8.

Unless Harbaugh figures out how to take on ohio, he can't be considered Bo 2.0..

[Jeff Buchanan]

Agree with Tom's take.

Tom's not the first M fan to note this. It's been one of Charles Woodson's, among other former players, who have said that M doesn't focus enough on beating osu. I think that might be changing in light of JH's record against them but, yeah, it has been a problem.

[iam416]

The reality, IMO, is M has been operating at a coaching deficit since Ohio State jettisoned Cooper and hired Tressel. And in a number of those years, the deficit has been massive. And when I say coaching deficit, that's intended as broadly as possible -- overall running of the program. Whatever LLLLLLLLLoyd Carr was at his peak, he faded and by the end Jim Tressel was significantly superior. RichGOD and Hoke? God fucking god. And HARBAUGH!!!! may be a very good coach, but he was up against an all-time great.

This is the first year that one would think that M has an overall coaching advantage. HARBAUGH!!!!! has been there for 5 years. It's his team. Frankly, it was his team last year. Ryan Day is a total newbie. He's inheriting a program that is running at an elite level, but he's still Ryan Day and he's still not UFM.

Honestly, if M doesn't win this year then I'm not sure what to tell you. If you felt like last was a crushing loss then a loss this year, at home to a newbie, shitass first year coach....woof.

[Jeff Buchanan]

.... Honestly, if M doesn't win this year then I'm not sure what to tell you. If you felt like last was a crushing loss then a loss this year, at home to a newbie, shitass first year coach....woof.

Attentive M football fans won't be shocked. Why? Because BronxBlue, the mgo guy that wrote the article I linked to up thread remarked in it that M fans may have potentially lowered the bar and have, I think this is how he put it, become resigned to a steady state 9-10 wins per season with the losses being an occasional head scratcher or to M's rivals - either ND, MSU, osu or all three.

I thought the streak would end in 2018. It didn't. I was upset about it. Then the bowl loss - I was done with following M football. Then, as time passed and with the hiring of Gattis as a sign that JH knew he needed to change his approach to the modern game, mild interest returned. It's a different sort of interest though. More detached, bystander type of interest watching what happens in CFB in general and specifically to the Wolverines with a bit of indifference.

I will say this. I am much less invested in M football than in the recent past. Some of that is age and the perspective that goes with it. But, I won't be shocked if osu comes into Ann Arbor and beats M again nor will I lose any sleep over it. I'll have travel, usually by cruise ship, cycling, seeing the grand kids grow up and generally enjoying retirement to look ahead to.

[Tom W]

Attentive M football fans won't be shocked. Why? Because BronxBlue, the mgo guy that wrote the article I linked to up thread remarked in it that M fans may have potentially lowered the bar and have, I think this is how he put it, become resigned to a steady state 9-10 wins per season with the losses being an occasional head scratcher or to M's rivals - either ND, MSU, osu or all three.

The fans didn't lower the bar. That's the work of the "Lucy and the football" way in which this program has been run for at least the last decade. Sure, we could walk away, and a lot of us have contemplated it. But if RRod and Hoke didn't scare us all away, we're probably going to keep on seeing it.

It has to be incredibly amusing to our guests to see us agonize over each and every stupid loss year in and year out.

[iam416]

Eh, there but for the grace of god goes us.

[lineygoblue]

It has to be incredibly amusing to our guests to see us agonize over each and every stupid loss year in and year out.

No doubt about it.

[drok]

Ok, prediction time.

11-1, loss to ND. Beat OSU. Win B1G, but left out of CFP.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Tom, the fans are reacting to the "Lucy and the Football" act emanating from the program so, the bar is lowered as a result. Can't get over a higher one. LLLLLoyd's final years (about 5 of them), the RR followed by the Hoke hire then Dave Brandon and his Toys-R-Us bull shit did immense damage - about a decades worth and more based on the results under 4y of JH - a solid hire if there ever was one. Warde seems OK but OK is just it. I'm resigned ...... but I could be convinced not to be.