Official Detroit Pistons thread

[froot loops]

That was a disappointment. That's a cheap extension if he stays healthy using Nike shoes.

[chemiclord]

Well, I guess there's a point where maybe the Pistons should stop being part of these deals if they're never going to get more than a pittance.

Maybe the next time a team dials up the Pistons to be a facilitator, and the discussion goes like this:

Team A: "We'll give you a couple throwaways and a second rounder so that we can get this player we really really want."

Pistons: "Bitch, we already have 20 picks in the second round. Sweeten the pot or piss off."

Stop making other teams better if they're not giving you anything in return. Let them try to find someone else to be their bag boy. Like seriously, what are the Pistons getting for helping out the rest of the league get the shiny toys they want?

[El Axe]

Seriously, I'm with Chemic. We could argue that putting either of those end-of-bench no-future players on the roster is a step backwards. So, we help out these teams and the only positive asset we get is one second round pick? Couldn't even manage a decent bench pg?

[froot loops]

Eh I don't know about that, they didn't have that many second round picks. They were at a serious deficit of them at one point because Weaver loved to trade them away. What you are proposing is to cut your nose off to spite your face. The next time there is a situation like the Luka trade, you want to be getting the call like the Jazz did.

You take the pick,.move on and bide your time. They got three picks for very little effort. You don't want to be the turd in the punchbowl. If your expectations for taking on a bench playing wing on an small expiring deal is anything more than a second round pick than the problem is your expectations.

This is really the first CBA with the new rules. Previous to it, you would have thought the cap space they had might have provided enough leverage to get more in return. But it didn't work out that way because enough teams participated that there was nobody that had to take on the onerous contracts that didn't want to. Basically, the Pistons were only going to get a first round pick if they took on a contract like Bradley Beal. Three months ago Lavine might have been another contract to take on, but he's had a great year so his value got better.

[BJK]

Sigh.

[chemiclord]

All I know is that the Pistons have been the facilitator for these sort of trades for years, new CBA or not, and it always seems like all they get out of it is a handful of second round picks that never amount to anything and a bunch of players that always wind up cut, sometimes even before the season ends.

Which I guess is fine on its own, I suppose. Yes, it's cheap assets for next to nothing. But at some point, perhaps the Pistons should be thinking about what they need to take that next step forward, and yeah, perhaps the next time someone calls to ask if the Pistons can take on their garbage so that they can make a big move, the Pistons should say, "Nuh uh. If you want [x] so badly, get some other parties involved that can hook us up with [y]. Otherwise, take your trash somewhere else."

And maybe they will, and the Pistons shouldn't shed a single tear if they do. It's getting about time that the Pistons become a part of these deals where they get something, not merely the bag guy that takes on other teams' litter so that it all works out.

[Mainevent]

I'll wait and see if anything else happens today. Smarter people than I have pointed out that depending upon how they sequence the finalization of these deals, they can still have access to use almost all of their cap space today.

I'm not expecting a bounty of first round picks, it would just be nice to actually get a player that would help the team this year rather than sub-JAG level guys. Backup PG or a rotation big that can shoot a little or provide some rim protection.

[froot loops]

They haven't really been doing this correctly for years though, with Weaver he was trading for guys that he thought were going to help the Pistons at the deadline. I'm talking specifically the Bagley and Wiseman deals. He also took on players to help other teams that he thought would help the Pistons like the Joe Harris and Alec Burks deals. He really didn't get shit for assets and those guys didn't help the team, meanwhile those deals alone helped the Knicks get Brogdon and the Nets re-sign Cam Thomas. Again the one time he had a true opportunity he had to get a first rounder at the deadline was for Bogdonavic was two deadlines ago and he held out for two first rounders,.which was a massive failure.

Weaver was so bad at it that they are still somewhat handicapped because they traded out that first for Stewart.

Langdon has been here less than a year and he shouldn't be burdened by what Weaver did. He made the Hardaway trade. His additions have help transform them into a fringe playoff team from a punchline team. If you want true upgrades at the deadline you need assets to trade. He came into the team and reportedly was shocked to discover that they didn't have much in assets

If next year they are doing the same thing, it's fair to complain but there hasn't been much traded at the deadline in salary dumps that are were going to help the team. Langdon being a Internet Hard Ass like chemiclord wants doesn't do much,.you are left holding the bag like Weaver was overestimating Bogdonavic's value.

[chemiclord]

I'm not expecting a bounty of first round picks, it would just be nice to actually get a player that would help the team this year rather than sub-JAG level guys. Backup PG or a rotation big that can shoot a little or provide some rim protection.

That there is the thrust of it. It's not about first round picks specifically, it's about being a part of a deal that actually improves this team, merely than being the NBA's landfill. At some point, if you're going to be a part of some deals, it's not unreasonable to ask for something semi-meaningful in return. And at some point, if that is all the rest of the league is going to offer, then I think there's nothing wrong with walking away from said deals.

This isn't a team that is just spinning their wheels, figuring they might as well get whatever lottery tickets they can get (both literally and metaphorically). They're a young team on the brink that actually has some fairly specific needs now. You can see a team identity, and can see specifically where they could use to improve. Langdon's made a lot of very savvy moves, and there should be more to come.

All I'm saying is there comes a point (and I think that point is fast approaching), where if a team says, "Hey, we really want to swing a deal to add Superstar McAmazing to our team; would you be willing to take on these two stale pieces of bread and this Millionaire Miles scratch off card to help us out?" that there would be nothing wrong with the Pistons saying, "Nah bro. I have needs myself here. Give me something worth my while."

[froot loops]

Again if you want to improve the team you have to send out assets. They don't really have a lot of assets to send out.

If you want to get first round picks you have to send out players people want. That would be any of the young guys that aren't Cade. The Lakers allegedly called about Duren before the Mark Williams trade but the price was allegedly steep for the Pistons. I'm not sure about the long term prospects for Duren, but he is an excellent lob man for Cade.

They have cap space, no expendable veterans that people want and a bunch of young guys that they probably want to keep for now. That means you are taking on contracts for second round picks, that's the reality.

[froot loops]

Hey, we really want to swing a deal to add Superstar McAmazing to our team; would you be willing to take on these two stale pieces of bread and this Millionaire Miles scratch off card to help us out?" that there would be nothing wrong with the Pistons saying, "Nah bro. I have needs myself here. Give me something worth my while."

This is what they did two years ago when teams were asking about Bogdanovic and Troy Weaver said. "Nah bro, one first rounder is not enough." So at this deadline they have one less draft pick to send out to improve the team.

[chemiclord]

Yeah, and that was a mistake for Weaver because there was nothing.

The Pistons are in a different situation now, where there are specific holes that need fairly specific types of players.

I don't think at this point there'd be anything wrong with telling these teams, "listen, if you need us as a facilitator, then this is what we're looking for."

If all the Pistons can expect us garbage, then I don't see any reason why they should be a part of these deals at all. It's not like Golden State is gonna say four years down the road, "These guys helped us out with the Butler trade. Let's help them out now."

[froot loops]

No you help.them out because you are getting assets. Second round picks are better than nothing because at some point you are using those second round picks to send out to get a a player who might help. Taking your principled stand doesn't get you any closer to winning but it makes for great Hot Takes.

[Blue Lagoon58]

Was Langdon hard assed enough for the couch GMs on this one?

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[froot loops]

Schröder is on an expiring deal.