Official Detroit Pistons thread

[ghandi]

Kidd didnt become even a mediocre shooter till much later in his career.....MCW is nowhere near the passer that Kidd was and I dont think he's sees the court all that well really.

[Kstat]

He's a work in progress. He's got better vision than Knight but Knight was actually putting the ball in the basket on a regular basis. He had to be guarded. Nobody guards MCW outside the paint. He has no outside or mid range game. He's not as good as Knight by any stretch right now.

The Bucks didn't want to pay Knight $70 million to stick around, so the traded for MCW, who has 2 years left on his rookie deal. The irony is that MCW is actually 2 months older than Knight is.

It freed the bucks up to sign Monroe, which is great. But they're decisively less reliable at guard than they were last season.

[froot loops]

Hardly any of these guys are ever finished products when they get drafted. It was much more advantageous to tank when you could draft a finished product out of college. Grant Hill, Tim Duncan, Shaq, etc... Those guys were ready right away. Nowadays you are building your team on free agents on their 2nd and 3rd contract. Every once in awhile you do have that finished product like LeBron but the odds of getting that from tanking are long, especially if numerous teams are doing it

This isn't to say the Pistons were doing it right either, but I mean come on, the Sixers actively shun wins and they won't be good this year.

[froot loops]

Kidd didnt become even a mediocre shooter till much later in his career

Jason Kidd was always a mediocre shooter. As he aged he quit driving to the basket and had to rely even more on that mediocre shot.

[The King]

OKC did it right because their lotto picks landed them Durant, Westbrook, and Harden. Philly is doing the same thing! They haven't been able to land the same types of players OKC did, but the strategy is the same.

Ibaka was a late pick, but he was basically a unknown from Africa.

[The King]

I would rather my team be terrible and at least have a shot at that elusive superstar by landing a high lotto pick, than being stuck picking around #8 for six years.

Who knows, maybe Okafor is that superstar for Philly. If he doesn't eventually average 20 a game, then something went terribly wrong.

[froot loops]

So far the startegy is landing them as the worst team in the league, in what epoch are they going to be good? How many years of being beyond terrible is worth it?

[chemiclord]

So far the startegy is landing them as the worst team in the league, in what epoch are they going to be good? How many years of being beyond terrible is worth it?

How many years of being slightly less than beyond terrible is worth maybe squeaking into the #8 seed at some point down the road?

I get what King is saying. What good is it to blow big money on players that aren't going to do anything for you? But at the same time, for all the resources they're stockpiling, the Sixers have gotten less than jack shit out of it. What good is it to have all these draft picks and cap space if you're not going to take your shot and actually use it?

That said... the Pistons have an entirely different problem. They can't lure free agents, and they're locked in this NBA Purgatory where they aren't quite good enough to make noise, but not quite bad enough to have a really good shot at that "one guy" who could change their fortunes. For all the "luck" they've had with the likes of Drummond or Monroe or Stanley Johnson dropping to them... after all these years, they're pretty much in the exact same place that they started in.

[Cody_Russell]

My thought on the 76ers:

They had a 0.001% chance (or something like that... VERY little) to win a championship with a core of Jrue Holiday, Spencer Hawes, Lavoy Allen, and Evan Turner.
Yes, the Eastern Conference is crap, but it is all about LeBron. Not even great teams in small markets (Pacers, Hawks) were able to be LeBron from 2011-2015. LeBron was going to win the East unless a super team (2008-2011 Celtics) was assembled.
The 76ers didn't have the assets or ability through free agency to create a team to beat LeBron.
It was a given that they would not win the championship in that time period.

The 76ers could "try their best" with what they had to compete. That would lead to being the 10th-20th best team in the NBA for the next couple of years. Worthless IMO. Attendance would still be in the 80% capacity area and they would be drafting players in the teens or late lottery.
Yes, some teams are able to find gems later in the 1st Round / or late lottery. I bet if you were to look at top 5 players drafted during the last decade, more would be better than players drafted later. You have a better chance at finding a franchise player when you pick higher.
For a medium/ small market team like Phili, that is the best way to assemble a "super team" that could beat LeBron. The OKC way. You couldn't do it through free agency with what they had. Trade? Yes, but what could they give? Draft picks / or Evan Turner / crap.

For tanking two seasons, the 76ers have 21 year old Joel Embiid, and 19 year old Jahlil Okafor. These players were arguably the most talented player in their drafts and (Noel, & Embiid) still deserve time to prove their draft spot. They also have Nik Stauskas now, who still could be a good role player.
They also will likely have 4 1st Round picks in the 2016 draft and several more draft picks.
Time will tell what they can turn those assets in, but it has more potential long term than the Phoenix Suns for example, who finish ranked 15th in the NBA every season.

As a 76ers fan, I would appreciate this strategy when compared to the worst thing... finishing between 8th-16th every season.

[Kstat]

Yeah...appreciating a decade of 15-20 win seasons.... Must be awesome to work for the Sixers. Winning is never your job, so long as you have gullible fans.

Their excuse for being horrible will be no different in 2020 and 2030 than it is now....

[Deuce]

OKC did it right because their lotto picks landed them Durant, Westbrook, and Harden. Philly is doing the same thing! They haven't been able to land the same types of players OKC did, but the strategy is the same.

Ibaka was a late pick, but he was basically a unknown from Africa.

No one has done what Philly is doing right now. Nick Collison has been with OKC since the Seattle days. Hinkie would have shot him in the face over playing him in one NBA game. No one has sabotaged the NBA like Hinkie, No one has failed so miserably to find NBA talent like Hinkie.

[Kstat]

Hinkie doesn't even try to find talent. He deliberately fills his roster out with cheap minimum guys that aren't good enough to be NBA players, to ensure the sixers continue to lose no matter how well they're coached or how hard they play.

No one will ever want to play for them. Their high priced draft picks are counting the minutes until they can leave.

[Deuce]

My thought on the 76ers:

They had a 0.001% chance (or something like that... VERY little) to win a championship with a core of Jrue Holiday, Spencer Hawes, Lavoy Allen, and Evan Turner.
Yes, the Eastern Conference is crap, but it is all about LeBron. Not even great teams in small markets (Pacers, Hawks) were able to be LeBron from 2011-2015. LeBron was going to win the East unless a super team (2008-2011 Celtics) was assembled.
The 76ers didn't have the assets or ability through free agency to create a team to beat LeBron.
It was a given that they would not win the championship in that time period.

The 76ers could "try their best" with what they had to compete. That would lead to being the 10th-20th best team in the NBA for the next couple of years. Worthless IMO. Attendance would still be in the 80% capacity area and they would be drafting players in the teens or late lottery.
Yes, some teams are able to find gems later in the 1st Round / or late lottery. I bet if you were to look at top 5 players drafted during the last decade, more would be better than players drafted later. You have a better chance at finding a franchise player when you pick higher.
For a medium/ small market team like Phili, that is the best way to assemble a "super team" that could beat LeBron. The OKC way. You couldn't do it through free agency with what they had. Trade? Yes, but what could they give? Draft picks / or Evan Turner / crap.

For tanking two seasons, the 76ers have 21 year old Joel Embiid, and 19 year old Jahlil Okafor. These players were arguably the most talented player in their drafts and (Noel, & Embiid) still deserve time to prove their draft spot. They also have Nik Stauskas now, who still could be a good role player.
They also will likely have 4 1st Round picks in the 2016 draft and several more draft picks.
Time will tell what they can turn those assets in, but it has more potential long term than the Phoenix Suns for example, who finish ranked 15th in the NBA every season.

As a 76ers fan, I would appreciate this strategy when compared to the worst thing... finishing between 8th-16th every season.

You can't go two straight years without having one NBA level starter which is what the 76ers have done Cody. Noel is the only guy that even resembles one and he is still really bad at this stage. They started Tony Wroten on purpose and let him have James Harden's Usage rate to boot.

What a fucking joke they are.

[Cody_Russell]

Hinkie has only been GM for 2 full seasons (because he was hired May of 2013). Both bad seasons landed him Embiid and Okafor.

I'm guessing this will be the last "bad season" and Phili will make a play to be competitive in 2016/2017.
Also, Hinkie did acquire Stauskas, who still has plenty of potential to be a good pro.

[nhwbrooklyn]

One thing I'm interested to see is the "toughness" and intensity of the whole team feels different with Morris and Stanley onboard. The Pistons have always needed that to be part of their identity when they've had success and Detroit fans eat it up (I do at least). I want to feel like this team fights to win games, even if they don't. SVG talks about this, but it only happened in tiny spurts last year.

I think KCP is willing to get in peoples faces and I love that. Drummond, when he plays angry, can do that, especially at this size and power, but he so rarely plays angry without fouling too much. If Morris and Stanley can bring some of that I really think it could make a big difference in the teams overall mentality.