Off Topic: Soccer and NASCAR

[froot loops]

He had tbis weird philosophy that seemed to be his guiding principle throughout his tenure, that you take players put them in different, unfamiliar positions and they will grow as players from having to do that. He did that with formations as well, they would play formations in qualifying games that they wouldn't be practicing.

It would have worked out fine if he was the manager for one Cup cycle, they did OK in 2014.

[Lem B]

Overhauling the whole system is unrealistic. You have to tweak the system, but some of the things like increasing club academies and improving the youth development system have been done, but the fruits of those benefits take awhile. The guys in their mid 20's to age 30 did not have that. The US does have a lot of players playing in Germany and England, but the promising ones are young. They talk about a lost generation, there are really only 3 guys worth anything in that age range from 23 to 30, Altidore, Bradley and Cameron.

Even saying that, there was no excuse for that performance. Warts and all the US produces enough players whether they are European based or MLS based to finish at worst 3rd in CONCACAF. They lost to a T and T roster that boasted of one player in a league of MLS caliber. They'll have a long time to figure it out, just don't hire a Charlatan like Klinsmann.

Over the past several years I have watched the USMNT and wondered why we can't find a center mid better than Bradley. He loafs around the field, always staying close to the ball, but RARELY making a play. I've never been more frustrated watching an athlete is ANY sport than I have witching MB.

[Marko69]

He had tbis weird philosophy that seemed to be his guiding principle throughout his tenure, that you take players put them in different, unfamiliar positions and they will grow as players from having to do that. He did that with formations as well, they would play formations in qualifying games that they wouldn't be practicing.

It would have worked out fine if he was the manager for one Cup cycle, they did OK in 2014.

Was his philosophy born out of experience do you think? I've not read any German history biographies of maybe Franz Beckenbauer, but could it be that Klinsmann is following the footsteps of his predecessors? I really don't know. I know that Guardiola at Man City has a "my way or no feckin way" attitude. Best players in the world admittedly playing in slightly different roles from previous clubs, but something is clicking for Pep.

I think that's what it's all about in my opinion. Something needs to "click into place" (and the players need to respect, and more importantly, like the manager). Of course the players also need to have the talent, the ability. I do feel that many managers mess about trying to find that formula. Mourinho would never admit it but that's what he was doing in his first year at Manure.

You ever see Mourinho being interviewed? Do you think he speaks like that in his own house?
"Fancy a cup of tea, Jose?"
"Well eef eets tea, then so be eet, eet eez what eet eez, eets not the caf?, eet eez tea, and so we will deal weeth the tea."

[chemiclord]

Meanwhile, in America:

"Would you like some coffee, Jozy?"

Altidore tries to take the cup, completely misses, then kicks it into the living room.

"Goddamn it, Jozy."

[Marko69]

^ ^

[Kstat]

I think if the goal is just to barely qualify for the WC every 4 years, then get embarrassed on arrival or get just lucky enough to get embarrassed in the first knockout stage, then yes a coaching change should be all that's needed.

Aiming to be Europe's bitch has always been the ceiling of USA soccer. Just get on the field with them. That's an accomplishment, right?

[Cleggy]

I think if the goal is just to barely qualify for the WC every 4 years, then get embarrassed on arrival or get just lucky enough to get embarrassed in the first knockout stage, then yes a coaching change should be all that's needed.

Are we talking about England here?:-D

[froot loops]

I agree with Kstat that just getting there isn't enough, but you do need to get there. Getting there helps you in the future to a time when getting out of the group stage isn't the goal. Failing to qualify for the Olympics and the U20 World Cup along with this fiasco means you are losing real games. You would like to think that this embarassment is some catalyst for substantial change, I think that proposition is dubious.

[Marko69]

Sorry, being thick here. (No change there then!) ..... ok, Italy at the World Cup not progressing further than the quarter finals is seen as a massive failure. A MASSIVE failure. As in heads of entire organisations needs to roll, not just the manager........, are you and Kstat thinking America should be consistently reaching as far the quarter finals at World Cups, possibly being close to on a par with Italy, Argentina, Spain? Because that aint happening in anyone on this forums lifetime.

[chemiclord]

It might, presuming the powers that be decide that getting bounced from qualifying for the World Cup creates a bad look for MLS and would potentially hurt their bottom line.

But I do agree that it probably won't change much, because the USSF is simply not going to allow the national side to be anything more than the MLS All-Star team with a handful of players in Europe who simply can't be ignored like Pulisic.

[Marko69]

I do understand the getting there...... fuck sake, Scotland haven't been there since 98, and never made it out of a group, thanks to Hansen & Miller, 1982 v USSR......, couple of fkn twats.

[Kstat]

I agree with Kstat that just getting there isn't enough, but you do need to get there. Getting there helps you in the future to a time when getting out of the group stage isn't the goal. Failing to qualify for the Olympics and the U20 World Cup along with this fiasco means you are losing real games. You would like to think that this embarassment is some catalyst for substantial change, I think that proposition is dubious.

They've been getting there for 24 years. It's done shit. Getting your young players experience means nothing if your young players are garbage. Clearly, the young American talent has been and will forever be crap so long as it's grown on American soil, in this absurd pay-to-win money pit that values profits over ability.

And as I said earlier, no I don't think this will be a catalyst for anything. I think a second failure in 2022 would be.

This country needs badly to go a full generation without seeing a World Cup before the desire to have a strong national team is so powerful that the entire system is uprooted and burned down in favor of locating and investing in the best talent no matter where it is.

[FVD]

Isn't the world cup field expanding from 32 to 48? Won't that make qualifying even easier than it is now?

[Marko69]

Isn't the world cup field expanding from 32 to 48? Won't that make qualifying even easier than it is now?

"And the 48th country to qualify is between San Marino & Scotland??., and??, (drum roll) oopsy daisy, its San Marino!"

[Marko69]

Maybe the USA should adopt Scotlands new qualifying tactics.