U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[Niffla]

Still waiting for someone to show me how U-M is a better team than State ...

MSU was ranked ahead of U-M in the polls before the BTC game. They beat U-M in their head to head meeting. They won their division with U-M in it. All of those things would indicate to me that State is the better team.

yet ... after they lost in the BTC to a very good Wisconsin team (that U-M didn't have to play even once) by 3 points, and if weren't for a stupid penalty likely would have won ....

... and now U-M is the better team? There is a reason the fandom at U-M has gotten the arrogant asses tag and it's on full display.

Had any of you had the balls ... and common sense ... to simply say that yeah State is the better team this year, but let's see what happens next then I wouldn't be having so much fund reminding you that State has kicked your ass 4 straight years.

Nebraska/ND kicks State's ass does that make them the better team? They were that day. But State had a better season then both of them. Does that make them the better team? Which qualification are you going to judge a team by? A single saturday or an entire season.

State & U-M both had 10-2 records .... what's the tie-breaker. Well, in case you forgot, State beat U-M when they played straight up. Game over.

I think you failed to see where I said that I agree that State gets the nod due to head to head.

[Niffla]

The bitterness almost makes the 4 straight losses worthwhile...;)

I've already mentioned it in this thread that I agree that State gets the nod due to head to head (THIS year) as far as the "better" team goes. But the stuff about being wronged because Mich is headed to the Sugar....too funny.

You got your asses kicked by Notre Dame and Nebraska. The loss in the BTC isn't why Sparty is getting penalized. Look back at those two ass beatings if you want a reason. Want a better bowl than Mich? Don't get slapped around by two teams that Michigan beat.

And why does Mass keep bringing up the 4 game win streak? WTF does that have to do with THIS year? Zero. And anyway -- just think, if State strings together another 10 in a row to make it 14 straight over UM, you'll only be 25 games behind in the all-time series!!

^^^^^

[Jamie H]

I'm also trying to figure out who is arguing that Michigan is better. All I said is that claiming MSU is somehow far superior to Michigan is silly, because if that were true, they wouldn't have been blown out by Nebraska and Notre Dame.

the teams are pretty similar. Both 9-2, both great at home and questionable on the road. MSU got the upper hand in East Lansing as you might expect in that kind of situation. They were certainly better than Michigan that day, just like Nebraska was better than MSU the day they played, just like Michigan was better than Nebraska the day they played.

[Niffla]

I'm also trying to figure out who is arguing that Michigan is better. All I said is that claiming MSU is somehow far superior to Michigan is silly, because if that were true, they wouldn't have been blown out by Nebraska and Notre Dame.

the teams are pretty similar.

This. I give State the nod solely due to the head to head game. That's it. For anyone to think that they're clearly better is laughable to me. They got their asses handed to them by two teams Michigan beat.

They get the edge by default due to the game in EL but otherwise, the gap between the 2 teams is small. Very small.

And IMO if the two met in AA tomorrow, Michigan would win. Just like i would have Sparty winning in EL tomorrow.

[Masspartan]

Well you didn't even try. You didn't even try in 2006. If you don't complain it will never change and at some level I think you guys are OK with it.

now I disagree froot. Most fans ... even the maize & blue ones ... want a playoff. Granted they love rubbing the weaker teams noses in their history at the same time, but it doesn't mean the casual fan doesn't want a playoff.

There isn't anything that we or they as fans are going to change about it. The fat cats couldn't care less what we want as long as the dollars are rolling in.

Isn't the NCAA going to have to step out and lead the change? The NIT Basketball Tourney used to crown a champ at one time ... right? Until the NCAA decided to host their own show. Isn't it going to take a similar decision by the NCAA to step and say ... OK boys, like it or not here's the way WE are going to crown the NCAA football champion. Or am I being a bit simplistic here?

[nhwbrooklyn]

The gap is small but clear

All you need to see it is to just imagine UofM playing MSU's 13 game schedule. They would have 4-5 loses IMO.

@ND, Wisconsin@home, Wisconsin@nutral, MSU@home, @OSU, @Iowa

6 games UofM would likely lose... but lets say they pull out 1 or 2 of them. 4-5 losses.

[SeattleLionsFan]

I don't agree. UM beats OSU pretty easy if they played when you guys played them. UM also beats MSU in the big house and I think beats Iowa 7 of 10 times. Especially if somehow Iowa didn't care if they beat us like they don't care about the State game.

Which leaves us with three losses, including one in the big ten championship game. Like I said. Pretty even.

[nhwbrooklyn]

No I don't think you take OSU at OSU. Their home field advantage is nearly as strong as UofM's so it's a bigger impact both ways. And taking MSU at home is 50/50 at best. I'd say you lose at least 1 of those 2. And Iowa is a given loss because it was a loss (both teams played at Iowa).

[Masspartan]

All I said is that claiming MSU is somehow far superior to Michigan is silly

who said "far". I believe all I typed was State > U-M. Never said the edge was small.

This. I give State the nod solely due to the head to head game. That's it. For anyone to think that they're clearly better is laughable to me. They got their asses handed to them by two teams Michigan beat.

what's laughable is that you couldn't simply admit that State > U-M at football in 2011. And there were some who were implying the reverse based on the fact that U-M was getting the better bowl.

I will give credit where credit is due .... U-M has closed the gap that has existed the last 4 years to a negligible margin. We'll see what 2012 brings.

[nhwbrooklyn]

I expect UofM to be MSU's equal or better next year. The loss of Cousins and the top 3 WRs will be a big impact (I think the loss of Worthy can be offset by Gholston, Rush, and improved linebacker play across the board).

The only way MSU wins another 10 games is if Bell just takes over as the top RB in the Big Ten taking massive pressure off Maxwell.

[whodean]

MSU folks are the ones with their panties in a wad.

[Jamie H]

What's laughable is that you couldn't simply admit that State > U-M at football in 2011. .

Oh you mean like you can't simply admit that Nebraska > MSU at football in 2011?

[Masspartan]

hadn't considered the lawsuit angle, but you are probably correct Jamie in that any uprising will have to originate in the courts. I probably thought the guy from UTAH was bat shit crazy a few years ago, but given time to consider .... he was more right than wrong ....

I don't know what kind of clout Boise State can bring to the table, but they REALLY have a case against the BCS shafting them out of millions of dollars.

They are alos the perfect example in my opinion of a team with lot's of seniors who actualy COULD give a power conference team trouble and end up with a chance to win the whole thing .... kind of Gonzaga or Butler like.

In the end a fat cat typically wins, but it sure is cool when the little guy makes some noise.

[Masspartan]

Oh you mean like you can't simply admit that Nebraska > MSU at football in 2011?

You don't really believe that crap right? Upsets never happen in your world?

Are you telling me that Appalachian State really WAS a better team than Michigan?

Are you telling me that Toledo really WAS a better team than Michigan?

Or is it possible that the better team went and laid an egg?

[DanO]

Sparty was better this year by all accounts. The gap isn't that far apart however. Next year UM may take back their rightfull place. :-)