U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[*JD*]

And if your goal is to win the Big Ten and have the Rose Bowl as a reward, that's fine.

But that's not Michigan's supposed goal. Their goal is to be a consistent national title contender. That means you have to be aggressive outside your region and find the cream of the crop consistently.

As I said, if they are top 5 nationally (currently #3 Rivals, #5 ESPN) I don't care where the crops are.

Also, while I think this might have just been the pat line, Coach Hoke DID say his goal is to win the B1G and go to the Rose Bowl.

[chemiclord]

As I said, if they are top 5 nationally, I don't care where the crops are.

Also, while I think this might have just been the pat line, Coach Hoke DID say his goal is to win the B1G and go to the Rose Bowl.

And as I said, that's one year. In another year where the midwest crop isn't as robust, you're going to need to lean on national recruiting to keep the talent stocked.

And I have no particular beef with Coach Hoke. If that's his goal, and the university supports it, so be it. But that's not been their professed goal during the latter Carr and RichRod years.

[*JD*]

The later Carr years he wasn't recruiting too well and RichRod? Well, he found a couple of good players from FLA.

I also said that Michigan landed one of the top Jr. QB's already for 2013. I think also having the opening game in Dallas next year should help down there. 'bamer probably will still be too much for us to handle but it could be good exposure. IF we pull the upset, that would be HUGE.

BTW- Scout has Michigan's class rated #1.

[Jamie H]

I was going to say, how the hell do you want them to be recruiting better than they are? As JD pointed out, Scout has them ranked #1 in the country, and they are still in on a few 4 & 5 star guys that have yet to decide. How could they be doing any better?

As for saying The Victors is a bad song, well that is just crazy talk. I don't expect it to be everyone's favorite or anything, but in the world of college fight songs, it is clearly among the top ones, as judged by pretty much anyone that has ever had anything to do with marching bands. What does saying it "doesn't have a beat" even mean? You would have to be completely deaf to not hear the beat in the song. Hell, you would have to be completely deaf to not hear the beat in pretty much ANY college fight song--they are all pretty straight-forward songs. It isn't like they are Copland or Hindemith or something.

[WingsFan]

RichRod's teams would meltdown in games like this on the road, so far Hoke seems to have Michigan playing well in the 4th. This was the first test (and passed) next week ...

[Kstat]

This season is gravy as far as I'm concerned. None of these guys are even Hoke's recruits. Kudos for outside thinking and getting this group to play better.

I'm really intrigued by the Gardner/Robinson formations.

[Kstat]

The scary thing is, if they beat MSU next week, they are likely playing in the big ten championship game.

[SeattleLionsFan]

Chemi- I love you man but you are seriously off base here. Tressel never recruited a player outside of Ohio and he did pretty well contending for natl championships.

Texas has never recruited a player outside of Texas and Florida feeds on Florida players. No team, except maybe ND, truly recruits nationally regularly. Every other team has 90% of it's players regionally with a sprinkling of national studs.

[SeattleLionsFan]

Yep. This one's a loss. Michigan still can't defend basketball on grass very well.

Good call! It was a pretty nerve wracking 18 point win though. This team has been very good at putting teams away this year which is good.

[DanO]

GO
BLUE!!!!!!

[Rocky Bleier]

Chemi's anti-Michigan is showing here. How was Hoke supposed to come in and recruit nationally after the last 3 years? He's done well in Michigan and Ohio, and as the team improves more out of state recruits will consider Michigan. He did get a 4star OT from CA and a 4star DT from MO this year. Ohio was loaded this year, too.

[Rocky Bleier]

As for saying The Victors is a bad song, well that is just crazy talk. I don't expect it to be everyone's favorite or anything, but in the world of college fight songs, it is clearly among the top ones, as judged by pretty much anyone that has ever had anything to do with marching bands. What does saying it "doesn't have a beat" even mean? You would have to be completely deaf to not hear the beat in the song. Hell, you would have to be completely deaf to not hear the beat in pretty much ANY college fight song--they are all pretty straight-forward songs. It isn't like they are Copland or Hindemith or something.

Jamie, who said the Victors song was bad? Consider the source.

[chemiclord]

Chemi's anti-Michigan is showing here. How was Hoke supposed to come in and recruit nationally after the last 3 years? He's done well in Michigan and Ohio, and as the team improves more out of state recruits will consider Michigan. He did get a 4star OT from CA and a 4star DT from MO this year. Ohio was loaded this year, too.

I'm not saying he can't or he won't.

I'm not even blaming Hoke for it. I'm wary about Michigan's approach to recruiting. For the longest time, their plan for recruiting (even regionally) was to send a scout or two, and say, "Hi, I'm from the University of Michigan. Sign here."

That approach isn't going to cut it anymore, and I think you saw that in Carr's final years. Recruits look at it, and say, "So why would I want to go with you and be a backup when I can go elsewhere and get just as much exposure if not more?"

There's a reason college football is becoming more competitive and the talent divide is closing rapidly between the power conferences and the mid-majors. Damn near every team is on television now, and if you don't sell yourself hard, players are going to go elsewhere.

Hoke had a great first recruiting class by all accounts, but I wonder if that was because of OSU's troubles funneling that Ohio talent towards Ann Arbor, or if the school really has changed their recruiting approach. Time will tell, I suppose.

P.S. As for my "anti-Michigan" bias; I beg to differ. I like seeing Michigan schools do well. If I didn't, I'd have been happy to see the collapse under RichRod. I despise the unjustified arrogance that comes from the brass in Ann Arbor, but that's the extent of it.

[Rocky Bleier]

I'm not even blaming Hoke for it. I'm wary about Michigan's approach to recruiting. For the longest time, their plan for recruiting (even regionally) was to send a scout or two, and say, "Hi, I'm from the University of Michigan. Sign here."


Hoke had a great first recruiting class by all accounts, but I wonder if that was because of OSU's troubles funneling that Ohio talent towards Ann Arbor, or if the school really has changed their recruiting approach. Time will tell, I suppose.

P.S. As for my "anti-Michigan" bias; I beg to differ. I like seeing Michigan schools do well. If I didn't, I'd have been happy to see the collapse under RichRod. I despise the unjustified arrogance that comes from the brass in Ann Arbor, but that's the extent of it.

Obviously, he's doing something right. He did pretty well in the month he had on the job last year, too. I wouldn't assume that OSU's troubles automatically funnels talent to the state's most hated rival either. As for the brass, I'll bet you enjoy "Three and Out" by John U. Bacon. I hear it's a pretty scathing revelation. I'm anxious to read it, though part of me wishes it hadn't been published.

[chemiclord]

Obviously, he's doing something right. He did pretty well in the month he had on the job last year, too. I wouldn't assume that OSU's troubles automatically funnels talent to the state's most hated rival either. As for the brass, I'll bet you enjoy "Three and Out" by John U. Bacon. I hear it's a pretty scathing revelation. I'm anxious to read it, though part of me wishes it hadn't been published.

Considering I've only seen small passages from it, this is my limited impression so far:

It confirms a lot of what I personally saw. I feel it apologizes a little TOO much for RichRod (the guy was pretty damn terrible without or without the clan infighting), but really does show very well that things were not (and probably still isn't) stable within Ann Arbor, and there's been a fight for the university's soul ever since it became clear that Carr was going to hang them up within the last two or three years of his tenure.