U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[DanO]

RichRod is a good coach. He didn't work here. Not all of that was his fault. He got little support.

GO LIONS "11" !

[Nick Pappageorgio]

Except that the U-M has completely raped the context of the speech and turned it into something that has nothing to do with what Bo meant.

ding ding ding ding.....winnah, winnah, chicken dinnah

[Niffla]

RichRod is a good coach. He didn't work here. Not all of that was his fault. He got little support.

GO LIONS "11" !

I don't think lack of support from a certain faction or two really has much to do with putting out the worst big school defense & special teams arguably ever seen in the modern era of college football.

[Nick Pappageorgio]

He was a failure because he didn't win games.

This and he tore the team apart along to get guys that fit into his style of play, going against with our long-standing philosophy, while not winning games.

If he had won a few more games.....or not torn the team apart to insert all those speed guys that "fit" in his style, I think he would have gotten another year.

Or if he had beaten OSU at least one time.

[jaadam4]

Or had a hint of holding a team under 500 yards from scrimmage. Or holding a team under 200 yards rushing.. Or a hint of scoring more than 14 points against a good team when thats supposed to be your signature.

[jaadam4]

Or even acting like you want to beat OSU if its the last thing on earth you do even if you cant.

[chemiclord]

I don't think lack of support from a certain faction or two really has much to do with putting out the worst big school defense & special teams arguably ever seen in the modern era of college football.

At the end of the day, Rodriguez couldn't get the job done, trying to change too much too quickly.

It's more that the warring factions didn't make the attempt any easier. One faction putting a player on the fast track to admission while the other arbitrarily changed the admission standards to shut that player out (for example) certainly didn't help RichRod's efforts, but it wasn't like he had no options to develop players and help them improve.

[Malto Marko]

Rich Rod wasn't a failure or hated because he wasn't a current day Michigan man. He was a failure and hated because he wasn't Bo's Michigan man.

One of the things that turned me off to him from the get go was in his interview when hired he was asked how important is the Ohio State game and his response was no more important than every other game. We expect to win every game we play.

He came pretty short on those expectations pretty quickly.

He was a failure because he didn't win games.

Even more importantly, got beaten by teams that he should have trounced.

The most inexcusable thing was how bad the special teams were.

Ya, he had the philosophy that a kicker (punter or place kicker) was nothing other than a low form of life and need not be addressed.

RichRod is a good coach. He didn't work here. Not all of that was his fault. He got little support.

GO LIONS "11" !

He might be a good coach in a league that only plays one or two games a season that you might be the underdog but, the Big Ten kicks each others asses every week. I have great respect for some of the SE Conference teams but believe that any of them would have a hard time competing year in and year out in the Big 10.

Look at Penn State. They were a perennial top 10 team and always in the hunt for the National Championship until they joined the Big 10. Then they became just another team with a storied background.

This and he tore the team apart along to get guys that fit into his style of play, going against with our long-standing philosophy, while not winning games.

If he had won a few more games.....or not torn the team apart to insert all those speed guys that "fit" in his style, I think he would have gotten another year.

Or if he had beaten OSU at least one time.

.....and had more players transfer than any other Coach in the history of the school with their replacements brought in the following recruitment class and not ready to play for another year after that.

.........loosing to your in state rival and biggest rival three consecutive years and still maintain it is just another football game suggests, his offensive and defensive philosophies were not in tune with the league he was Coaching in.

At the end of the day, Rodriguez couldn't get the job done, trying to change too much too quickly.

It's more that the warring factions didn't make the attempt any easier. One faction putting a player on the fast track to admission while the other arbitrarily changed the admission standards to shut that player out (for example) certainly didn't help RichRod's efforts, but it wasn't like he had no options to develop players and help them improve.

I believe Harbaughs comments about the standards at Michigan vs Stanford was a direct attack at Rich Rods willingness to bring in criminals and thugs as opposed to players that have integrity as well as skills.

Knowing that Forcier was in trouble academically and not monitoring his progress to make sure he remained eligible proves he did not care about teaching responsibility or making sure Student Athletes get their education, only that they show up to practice.

[froot loops]

The Michigan Man speech was great.

[gjdodger]

You know--I don't understand all the gyrations people are going through in trying to identify Schembechler's concept of a "Michigan Man." All he said was that since Frieder had divided loyalties, he should not coach Michigan in the tournament. Maybe he was right and maybe he was wrong, but I don't see that Schembechler tried to define the term beyond that. In fact, you could say that it was just about money; Frieder had committed to accepting his money the following year from somebody else. Is a "Michigan man" somebody who is paid only by Michigan, and not another university? That makes it tautological.

[nhwbrooklyn]

I wouldn't read into to much... its just an artificial construct that makes people feel better. But it has real value for that very reason.

Hoke is a Michigan man. RR is not. That will help Hoke and it hurt RR.

[DanO]

"I don't think lack of support from a certain faction or two really has much to do with putting out the worst big school defense & special teams arguably ever seen in the modern era of college football."
---------------------------I can't argue with that. It's accurate. RR screwed himself when he came in, arrogant as hell(maybe somewhat earned by some of the animosity towards his hire), and said, I'm going to do this my way and decided there was no transitional phase.

GO LIONS "10" !!!!!!!!!!

[DanO]

"Hoke is a Michigan man. RR is not. That will help Hoke and it hurt RR."
----------------------It will help him have a higher acceptance among fans and the ever critical "boosters" but it won't make him a better coach. Maybe he'll be a great coach and I'm just a dumbass(OK I am a dumbass but that's beside the point) but all the fucking support in the world won't help this guy be a better coach. I REALLY REALLY, hope I'm wrong on this. I just see him as mediocre. A lesser version of Carr. Maybe he'll improve on RR's last year but I don't see it happening next year or even the year after. He'll get plenty of time though because he's a Michigan man.

Michigan Man-----------------I'm sorry. I laugh at that. Your top priority should be to bring in the best fucking coach. Not the best fucking coach, who'll accept the job, because he's a Michigan Man. That's a joke.

GO LIONS "11" !

[nhwbrooklyn]

Hey man I got jazzed when Dantonio hyped up what it means to be a Spartan and hyped up playing rival UofM and all that... stuff works

Embrace the Michigan Man rhetoric

[froot loops]

You know--I don't understand all the gyrations people are going through in trying to identify Schembechler's concept of a "Michigan Man." All he said was that since Frieder had divided loyalties, he should not coach Michigan in the tournament. Maybe he was right and maybe he was wrong, but I don't see that Schembechler tried to define the term beyond that. In fact, you could say that it was just about money; Frieder had committed to accepting his money the following year from somebody else. Is a "Michigan man" somebody who is paid only by Michigan, and not another university? That makes it tautological.

Shhh

Its fun to to provide a caricature that is an albatross.