U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[SeattleLionsFan]

what does a top 3 team mean? And please do not begin to compare State's record as a "powerhouse" with Michigan's. Its dumb.

[chemiclord]

I have absolutely NO problem agreeing that Michigan was one of the foundations of college football. They have the history, the tradition, the wins...

But the history isn't the now. Michigan isn't the center of the college football world anymore. Teams like Notre Dame don't drop U-M from their schedule because they are "scared." They drop them because... well... U-M isn't that important anymore. They aren't THAT big of a deal.

I understand that hurts a lot of Wolverine fans. To just be another team on the schedule. So they convince themselves that the Irish are "scared" of them. "They don't wanna play us any more because they're afraid we'll beat them." Again, I ask you Michigan fans, would you drop MSU or Ohio State to keep Notre Dame on the schedule? I think the overwhelming answer would be "no." They're the third most important team of that group. It's just hard for Wolvy to accept they're #3 in Notre Dame's world as well.

[SeattleLionsFan]

It's so fun to attack a strawman....

I will note for the record however that Michigan has won five of the last seven.

[chemiclord]

What's a strawman about it? Do tell.

I laid out exactly why Notre Dame is backing out of the Michigan game. They have two spots for three teams. They have a longer tradition with the two others.

IT'S EXACTLY THE SAME REASONING Michigan would use if they had to choose between OSU/MSU/ND. Notre Dame would be on the outside looking in. Do you refute that?

[Deuce]

I have absolutely NO problem agreeing that Michigan was one of the foundations of college football. They have the history, the tradition, the wins...

But the history isn't the now. Michigan isn't the center of the college football world anymore. Teams like Notre Dame don't drop U-M from their schedule because they are "scared." They drop them because... well... U-M isn't that important anymore. They aren't THAT big of a deal.

I understand that hurts a lot of Wolverine fans. To just be another team on the schedule. So they convince themselves that the Irish are "scared" of them. "They don't wanna play us any more because they're afraid we'll beat them." Again, I ask you Michigan fans, would you drop MSU or Ohio State to keep Notre Dame on the schedule? I think the overwhelming answer would be "no." They're the third most important team of that group. It's just hard for Wolvy to accept they're #3 in Notre Dame's world as well.

(start short Froot approved post) Yep, in the matter of regional importance Michigan is 3rd....to Purdue and Michigan St. (end duration of the Froot approved length and quality of post)

If your argument is ND has simply played the other 2 longer and by default (as if no human reasoning was used) HAD to select those two 3rd tier programs then let that be your argument. Don't try to sneak in a "Michigan isn't important anymore" jab. It's not true and no one believes it, as evidenced by the fact that Michigan has probably never been more relevant than they are RIGHT NOW in recruiting, You know, elite recruits generally want to play for RELEVANT programs right? They want to be seen and thought of. Not very many programs get as much exposure of UM. Find out why that is, then you will see Michigans national relevance.

[WingsFan]

Every historical rich college football program has a down period, Oklahoma, Alabama, USC, ND, Miami, Nebraska, Michigan, Ohio St, FSU, Auburn ect..


Haters gonna hate, especially if they had a bad experience with the schools HC

[froot loops]

Simply put Hoke's words on the rivarly would carry a lot more weight if the Michigan side never uttered any words about ending the rivalry. There was no shortage of Michigan people who expressed a desire in suspending the series so they could play other big programs. The last time they extended the contract there was at least some question on how long it was going to continue and they did have a pause in the last decade in playing.

pANDs

MSU has not been a great program since Duffy retired, but its definitely not a 3rd tier program. Swagger has a lot to learn, but he's a newbie. Remember, I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together.

[chemiclord]

Every historical rich college football program has a down period, Oklahoma, Alabama, USC, ND, Miami, Nebraska, Michigan, Ohio St, FSU, Auburn ect..


Haters gonna hate, especially if they had a bad experience with the schools HC

This has nothing to do with "hate."

It's the ludicrous idea that Notre Dame is RUNNING SKURRED from Michigan. It's just silly, especially when there are perfectly legitimate reasons why Michigan is the odd man out.

[chemiclord]

Simply put Hoke's words on the rivarly would carry a lot more weight if the Michigan side never uttered any words about ending the rivalry. There was no shortage of Michigan people who expressed a desire in suspending the series so they could play other big programs. The last time they extended the contract there was at least some question on how long it was going to continue and they did have a pause in the last decade in playing.

pANDs

MSU has not been a great program since Duffy retired, but its definitely not a 3rd tier program. Swagger has a lot to learn, but he's a newbie. Remember, I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together.

When the Big Ten expands to 14 teams in 2014, Brandon has said to the effect that scheduling Notre Dame would be problematic; the insinuation being that Michigan was going to drop the Irish.

Maybe that's what this is all about. Ya know when you want to break up with a girl, but she breaks up with you instead? Even though you were going to break up with her anyway, you get all worked up because YOU were supposed to be the one that called it off. Maybe poor Wolvy is just upset that the Irish beat them to it.

[*JD*]

Oh yeah, here we go with that steroids thing. That had to be it. Ha!

Well, according to you, it couldn't have had anything to do with good recruiting.

[WingsFan]

This has nothing to do with "hate."

It's the ludicrous idea that Notre Dame is RUNNING SKURRED from Michigan. It's just silly,

Right, your just full of happiness and joy all the time.

And it is just silly, that's why everyone was laughing, another reason I like Hoke. He is not worried about the other teams feelings, 'This is Michigan' is his attitude. Don't care if ND has a legit reason or not - fuck them! - Hoke called them chicken and even their AD had to respond is great. Calling Ohio ST 'Ohio' is great too.

Stir the pot Hoke! Shows confidence knowing your team is better.

RRs constant crying and tear drops made him look weak, hell he even let Danny Hope embarrass him after the game.

[SeattleLionsFan]

I'd love to know your cite for that because I think you are full of shit.

According to this Michigan had the third best winning percentage in the 70's.

http://collegefootball.about.com/od/schools/a/Winningest-College-Football-Programs-Of-The-1970s.htm

(and 8th in the 80's and 7th in the 90's)

Now, if you want to say that Michigan didn't have the 3d most wins, that's fine, but neither did State in the 50's. Teams with more wins than State include Oklahoma, Mississippi, Georgia Tech, and Tenneesee.

http://collegefootball.about.com/od/schools/a/Winningest-College-Football-Programs-Of-The-1950s.htm

Plus I don't think Bo ever got the program on probation for cheating his way to the record, unlike "Biggie" and "Duffy"

[*JD*]

Is Biggie a nickname for Tressel?

[SeattleLionsFan]

Biggie Munn. He's spartys most successful coach although he was a big fucking cheater too.

[*JD*]

I've honestly never heard of him.