U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[jaadam4]

Probably because he's a habitual rule breaker, and eventually people find that irritating, no matter how minor the rules are.

What rules has he broken? He bought a kid a cheeseburger. I know that one but what else? He rubs everyone the wrong way but you’re re writing history with that.

They even took the high road and suspended him for 3 games when they didn’t have to. The Big Ten should be conducting a fair investigation allowing Michigan to at least respond. Waiting until 4 pm on a Friday with a holiday and game day the following day is complete Bush league. Due process not pitchforks and torches.

[jaadam4]

This is my favorite part of the letter from the Big Ten


We impose this disciplinary action even though the Conference has not yet received any information indicating that Head Football Coach Harbaugh was aware of the impermissible nature of the sign-stealing scheme.

[JGSpartan]

If you don't know what rules were broken then that is definitely a you problem. That information is widely reported for both scenarios if you don't gobble it up from a biased source that would try to reframe things as buying cheeseburgers.

[JGSpartan]

That's a quick read that answers your questions.

[jaadam4]

That's a quick read that answers your questions.

Did you read any of that? So basically it says the Big Ten affirms that there’s no links to Jim Harbaugh even knowing this was going on and that the B1G hasn’t provided the proper documentation to Michigan from the beginning of the season allegations or the new ones from 2 weeks ago.

They’re not even going through the proper process. The B1G is either going to have a smoking gun and BBQ Michigans ass or the B1G is going to look like complete fools when Michigan is done with them.

I suspect Ohio is behind the “private investigation” that handed over all the docs to the B1G and NCAA. They’ve been getting absolutely steam rolled by Michigan the last few years and this year looks like it’s going to happen again

[jaadam4]

I’ll be curious to see how Michigan comes out and plays. Playing in HV has always been really tough for the Maize and Blue. They have a loud crowd and it’s going to be really hostile with all the allegations.

I have a feeling this shit is going to fuel Michigan. Harbaugh lives for this crap and this team is built just like him. His players love him.

If it’s a close game / loss, Michigan will get a ton of negative media because of their strength of schedule which could weigh them down and they be out of the playoffs IMO. If Michigan throttles Penn State in their house they’ll be out for Ohios blood and I don’t think they’ll be anything Bucknuts can do about it

[chemiclord]

I doubt OSU is behind this. I can't imagine the Buckeyes want to open that Pandora's box and have everyone and their mother combing over their activities. If I had to take a guess, I'd wager the PI was looking specifically into Stalions (apparently the dude has a bit of a history of being a bit of a con-artist and all-around shyster), and the U-M was really more his most recent employer.

Here are the things I can buy:
- That the NCAA and the Big Ten have considered Harbaugh a thorn in their side, likely in no small amount because he was one of the first "big name" college coaches calling for compensating players.
- The Big Ten wants to drop the hammer on Michigan and move on before too many people start looking terribly closely at anyone else.
- The NCAA would rather it not be much of a story at all as it is even by their own admission such a minor violation they were considering dropping the rule entirely as soon as last year.
- A lot of bad faith actors intentionally blew up the story hoping to get exactly this.

Here are the things I DON'T buy:
- That Harbaugh had no idea in knowing how Conor Stalions was so good at deciphering other teams' signs to a level that no one else ever did before. He knew what was going on.
- That it didn't offer much competitive advantage. The Wolverines record before and after Stalions's hiring, as well as how badly they played against teams they weren't able to get "advance scouting" on suggest it was giving Wolvy far more of an edge than the typical sign stealing normally would.

[dsred]

If I'm U of M I'm telling the B1G to fuck off and either joining the SEC or going independent a la Notre Dame. M is a big draw all by itself. The B1G needs M more the M needs the B1G.

[JGSpartan]

I understand that there's no direct evidence connecting Harbaugh but like Chemi I'm also just not buying that he didn't know. But even if he didn't, that article does state that it doesn't matter. Due to the conference bylaws he can be held responsible for the violations of his staff.

I do agree with the assessment that there has to be a true smoking gun or Michigan will be justified in their arguments. Given that both the Big Ten and the NCAA are expediting their processes I would be very surprised to see the evidence not being clear cut. If it was just the Big Ten I'd be more likely to believe the pressure campaign without evidence argument.

[dsred]

I understand that there's no direct evidence connecting Harbaugh but like Chemi I'm also just not buying that he didn't know. But even if he didn't, that article does state that it doesn't matter. Due to the conference bylaws he can be held responsible for the violations of his staff.

I do agree with the assessment that there has to be a true smoking gun or Michigan will be justified in their arguments. Given that both the Big Ten and the NCAA are expediting their processes I would be very surprised to see the evidence not being clear cut. If it was just the Big Ten I'd be more likely to believe the pressure campaign without evidence argument.

Bull. He's been given what amounts to a death penalty for jaywalking based on circumstantial evidence. Enough pearl clutching from you biased Sparty Slappies.

[JGSpartan]

He's been given 3 games of not even a full suspension. I've also stated before I don't hate Michigan and wished this wasn't happening. My best friend is a Michigan fan and I while I won't claim to be a fan I often root for them to win for the betterment of the conference if they are our representative.

That doesn't change the situation. Michigan Fan's like you have said they don't need the Big Ten and could move. The reality though is that's also true for the likes of Ohio State or Penn State and perhaps a couple others. If the Big Ten does nothing they are taking a big risk there too.

The assumption that all they have is circumstantial evidence is just that, an assumption. The NCAA investigation is still ongoing and the Big Ten has been given information from that which hasn't been made public. What that is we don't know. It could be the smoking gun. It could not.

I knew that being a Spartans fan and having it in my username would make it difficult to talk about this subject seriously but I am genuinely trying to view this in a non-biased way. These scandals at the end of the day are very bad for the conference. MSU has contributed more than enough negative bullshit to that themselves, So has OSU and PSU even if those are a few years back now. I have even wanted OSU to win in the CFP. Though I couldn't bring myself to actively watch and cheer for it.

[JGSpartan]

If it’s a close game / loss, Michigan will get a ton of negative media because of their strength of schedule which could weigh them down and they be out of the playoffs IMO. If Michigan throttles Penn State in their house they’ll be out for Ohios blood and I don’t think they’ll be anything Bucknuts can do about it

This is the primary reason I actually wish Harbaugh would be on the field. Losing now adds more questions than just strength of schedule. Especially if it's close.

Winning against PSU and OSU answers the strength of schedule questions that exist either way. It would actually be an even bigger boon for them now that would probably lock them into the 1 spot.

I would rather it just be all teams at their best from an on-field perspective.

[jaadam4]

Woooooo. Man that Penn State crowd is pumped!

[chemiclord]

Not a terribly good start for Wolvy.

[jaadam4]

Little Brother only has watching Michigan and praying someone can do what that can’t. Harbaugh has big shoulders.