U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[Masspartan]

Chemi ... you are approaching Lefors territory with this one. IU is one of the fastest most efficient teams in the country. Its stupid to argue otherwise. Of course they look slower playing big ten teams who play real defense and know their tendancies. The Big East was overrated and their tourney results proved it. Simple east coast biss. The results have of the big ten have shown in the tourney. more final fours then anyone

[Deuce]

Chemi ... you are approaching Lefors territory with this one. IU is one of the fastest most efficient teams in the country. Its stupid to argue otherwise. Of course they look slower playing big ten teams who play real defense and know their tendancies. The Big East was overrated and their tourney results proved it. Simple east coast biss. The results have of the big ten have shown in the tourney. more final fours then anyone

Big East was overrated in 2009, but only when the East Coast media started saying that they were the best conference EVER. That year they were the best top to bottom.

[chemiclord]

Chemi ... you are approaching Lefors territory with this one. IU is one of the fastest most efficient teams in the country. Its stupid to argue otherwise. Of course they look slower playing big ten teams who play real defense and know their tendancies. The Big East was overrated and their tourney results proved it. Simple east coast biss. The results have of the big ten have shown in the tourney. more final fours then anyone

I'm comparing two high risk/low reward options? That LeFors territory? Okay... not sure how that makes sense, but sure.

I can buy the efficiency. I, as of this point, haven't SEEN the speed that you are lauding. Maybe it IS a consequence of the conference play (I even acknowledge as much). We'll see.

We'll also see when it comes to Big Ten superiority. A lot of the reputation for Wisconsin, Minnesota, Illinois (the second tier that supposedly is the depth of the conference) has basically come from beating other Big Ten teams (much like the Big East did during their heyday). Meanwhile, the OOC resume for the top tier of the conference really doesn't reflect superiority... again, just like the Big East during its heyday.

And hell, if I turn out wrong, so be it. Maybe you're all right. We'll see in late March/early April.

[SeattleLionsFan]

Illinois beat the #1 team in the country on the road...they are amazing...

[nhwbrooklyn]

UofM basketball took a page from MSU football this year. That was excruciating to watch happen.

[nhwbrooklyn]

Chemi you're argument is, if i got it right, nuts (maybe I didn't get it right, I ran through it all pretty fast just now). The big tens track record in the tourney is literally the best there is, and yes in recent times.

There are good teams, well coached teams, with NBA players on them going at it. This year the big ten is leaps and bounds better than any other conference too.

[nhwbrooklyn]

OK reading back through the posts there are two things I'd like to add.

1) The efforts to quantify who beat who and why that makes so and so better is difficult because college hoops is just like that and basketball is just like that and the teams today are not the same teams that started the year. Some are significantly better and others are not.

2) The big ten is the best and being said so for a reason. There isn't a killer team out there that is head and shoulders above anyone else. Only maybe 4 teams can hang with the big tens top 4 IMO. Now it's basketball and anyone can beat anyone on any given night but I suspect the big ten will represent itself well like they have in recent history.

[chemiclord]

My argument is I'll believe it when I see it.

And I haven't seen what is being claimed.

[Masspartan]

Big East was overrated in 2009, but only when the East Coast media started saying that they were the best conference EVER. That year they were the best top to bottom.

I certainly never said the Big East wasn't the best. Then again when you have half of the D1 teams in your conference how couldn't you be, lol.

However, the media bias for the Big East has been enormous the last several years and I know this because every March I get the opportunity to tease my cousin who lives near Syracuse and grew up in NYC.

The Big East would consistently get seeded in the tourney several spots higher than they should be and then flame out. One year they had something like 6 of the top 16 seeds and didn't send a single team to the final four. Perhaps only one even made the sweet 16. It was laughable and my cousin got pissed at me for pointing it out ... and that for the 3rd or 4th consecutive year Big East teams flopped in the tourney.

I don't think you'll see that from the Big 10 this year as history has shown.

IU
Michigan (if they D up)
Wisconsin
Michigan State
Ohio State

Wouldn't surprise me if 4 of 5 were in the sweet 16. 3 in the final 8.

[nhwbrooklyn]

I think you're crossing your wires chemi. Big Ten football is often overrated. I agree. This shows up in the bowl games. Big Ten basketball on the other hand isn't. They have done the best in the Tourney, based on their seeding, in recent history.

[DanO]

"Indiana swept the Michigan schools, they are a notch above everyone else..."
-------------------------------BULLSHIT. They did win and I give them credit for it......................both UM and MSU lost the games. Indiana got lucky. Luck has followed them this year.

[Rocky Bleier]

Indiana scored the last 6 points of the game. Michigan missed their free throws down the stretch. Indiana destroyed Michigan on the boards. It wasn't luck. Michigan choked.

[nhwbrooklyn]

The difference is the end game. Indiana is very good there. They got the clutch players and the types of players to do what they need at in end game scenarios.

MSU doesn't have that last shot guy at all. Appling has been inconsistent and Harris has done everything well except execute at the end of the game. The bigs are great but not last shot of the game types either.

UofM just goes to Burke mode or Hardaway bombs at the end of the game. Not very complex.

And still, UofM hit's their free throws and they win their home court. MSU hits their free throws and they win their home court (and Zeller doesn't trick the ref's and get inside Nix's head).

[DanO]

Sorry. Luck was the wrong term. UM choked, MSU choked.

YEP!! Did that make Indiana better or did the two teams just lose it?

[nhwbrooklyn]

Chances are UofM or MSU will get another shot at UI so we don't have to wait long to see.