U of M thread (in the Lions Forum) :)

[Mainevent]

Mallett transferred because of the offense/staff. So did Boren. Those were 2 pretty big pieces that moved on. You don't think this team would have been a shitload better with those 2 and a conventional offense the past 2 years?

[SeattleLionsFan]

Absolutely they would have been better.

But those two players don't make the difference between good and where they were/are.

[Mainevent]

Those 2 players and a familiar offensive system sure would make up a lot of the difference. Maybe Manningham/Arrington stay as well.

Now the defense, well, it couldn't have been any worse.

[jaadam4]

I have to believe that Mallet wouldve been a badass here. I was really sorry to see him leave when ahole came aboard.

[chemiclord]

Mallet really wasn't falling into sync with Carr's system either, as I understand.

[Rocky Bleier]

Is there no depth at Michigan?

I've been telling you that for a couple of years. Discussed in depth here:

http://www.wtka.com/index.php?fuseaction=home.podcasts_sel&id=6634

and here:

http://www.wtka.com/index.php?fuseaction=home.podcasts_sel&id=6635

[froot loops]

Its one thing to not have depth to beat the top echelon programs. I've said that, you aren't telling me something I didn't know. But even with defections and a lower ranked recruiting class in recent years you still should win more than 3 freaking Big Ten games. 3 games? you can't tell me that depth is that much of an issue. Coaching was a huge part of that failure.

[SeattleLionsFan]

Michigans last two years demonstrate failures on multiple fronts. Coaching is a big part of it. The talent level is also part of it.

[froot loops]

Well, when you get this offensive guru who needs his type of players to fit his type of system, you start getting "talent" issues.

I do remember that they had 9 returning defensive starters from a team that whipped Florida, yet they couldn't stop anyone the next year.

[Rocky Bleier]

I do remember that they had 9 returning defensive starters from a team that whipped Florida, yet they couldn't stop anyone the next year.

Whipped? Florida scored 35 points on that defense. Appalachian State - 34, Oregon 39, Eastern Michigan 22, Michigan State 24, Wiconsin 37. Yeah, they were great.

[froot loops]

Good enough as returning starters not to be doormats to the Big Ten. Its weird, you cherry pick offensive games against mediocre teams to pump up Rodriguez and his offense. Yet you ignore some of the good defensive games against other teams in 2007, presumably because it hurts your argument.

Again, I'm not saying the talent hadn't dipped, they were not top echelon. But they sure as heck didn't have a talent level to be as bad as they were in 2008. When you have 9 returning starters you should have at least an average defense. But when Rich Rod came in he made it abysmal. All of a sudden the "talent" wasn't there. Not one person said prior to that season that they had talent to be a doormat on defense.

If you can hold that Florida team in a bowl game to 35 points and you can win, that means you should be able to hold the fightin Illin to less that 45 at home.

[chemiclord]

There had been no indication the defense was average to begin with even in their element. I don't see how anyone could think they'd be average coming into a new system with a new coaching staff that stressed different elements.

[froot loops]

Not one person was saying this prior to that season. They were stressing the 9 returning starters. At the very least the talent level as good as a middle of the pack big ten team. Its very similar to Lion optimigos. Always stressing system and lack of talent. Good coaches can whip teams into shape even if the talent is lacking.

If you can't do that, you have to start wondering why the guy was hired in the first place. And if it takes all this time and recruiting to do this, one wonders why they hired that "system" in the first place.

[Rocky Bleier]

Good enough as returning starters not to be doormats to the Big Ten. Its weird, you cherry pick offensive games against mediocre teams to pump up Rodriguez and his offense.

Not at all. I said they put up points against bad or average defenses, but were dominated by the good ones.


"But when Rich Rod came in he made it abysmal." Explain to me how he personally made the defense abyssmal. Hiring Shafer? One problem is that those kids had 3 different coordinators in their careers.

[MikeyPaint]

GO BLUE....