(G)obbled (B)ears (U)p - Thanksgiving GBU Thread

[maxw3ll]

Vildor sucks but they don't hand out trophies this time of the year. Some big pieces will come back. I would rather have them for a deep playoff run.

I think det is playing with house money after wins vs hou and chi.

Decker and Davis alone would have increased the lions’s chances significantly.

Hopefully Pascal and Levi can return soon. Anzalone will be back at the end of the season. Maybe Mosely is worth the wait?

I was also pumped for smith. Det probably loses the game if he is not in a lions uniform.

[froot loops]

The defense did rise to the occasion. The PI on Vildor was bullshit, the game should have been over at that play. After that BS penalty the pass rush forced a 10 yard penalty and then sacked Williams to put them out of the field goal range. They did that with 6 reserve players out there, most of them were PS players a few weeks ago. That was a ballsy effort from the defense. Bravo d.

Not to mention how good the defense was in the first half before the parade of injuries started. They shut them down to the point where they should have been up by a hell of a lot more than 16.

In the olden days of the Lions, if you had that many significant players out of the lineup, the Lions would have given up 40 points. What are we even doing here? Everyone wants every game to be a 17-35 point blowout. That's not the NFL, what the Lions have done in there 11 wins has been remarkable for how many blowouts there have been

Great fucking win.

[Iron Lion]

Agreed Froot. I think Duh Bears went into the locker room at halftime and said to themselves, "Ok men, do we wanna just get blown out, or do we wanna lose in heartbreaking fashion? Because there is no 3rd option. We're the same old Bears."

[DanO]

We'll see Loops. Just remember that BS penalty call is the norm against the Lions and not an aberration. I hope you're right but I don't see this defense as SB quality. The expectation among the team and the fans is, and has been since the season started, the SB or bust. I just don't see this defense being able to compete at a high enough level to make that happen. Again, hope like hell I'm wrong.

[froot loops]

Again PFF has this team rated as the #1 rated defense. Kerby Joseph is playing at an All-Pro level, Branch is rated as a high level Pro Bowl level and at times he is been at All Pro level (over 90 PFF). Jack Campbell has been in the high 70's as the MIKE. Reader and McNeil have been great in the middle. Za'Darius Smith has been great since his addition. The corners are still pretty good. The results speak for themselves. That was a great defensive performance Thursday

If this team currently doesn't have a Superbowl level defense, what teams have one? The Lions results have spoken for themselves.

You are focusing on the injuries and flaws because you are intently following this team.

[Mainevent]

They had a good chance to win last year’s Super Bowl and the defense is leaps and bounds better, even with the injuries.

[ghandi]

I can understand DanO's concern....How much longer can they keep trotting out Vildor and Dorsey and a bunch of other teams practice squad guys? I know it's a "next man up" mentality but eventually that next man up isn't as good and it will cost them at some point....I hope you are right Froot.

[Iron Lion]

Where is Commish, we need you buddy.

[Mainevent]

I can understand DanO's concern....How much longer can they keep trotting out Vildor and Dorsey and a bunch of other teams practice squad guys? I know it's a "next man up" mentality but eventually that next man up isn't as good and it will cost them at some point....I hope you are right Froot.

Arnold was back on Thursday and Davis doesn’t seem like he’ll be a long term thing.

[froot loops]

Some of the practice squad players they are relying on are proven veterans that they signed after they got cut in a numbers game at other teams. David Long had a 93 PFF run grade in 2023, Kwon Alexander should have something left in the tank. They aren't promoting nothing burgers like in the years past.

Carlton Davis should be returning. With Davis, Robertson, Arnold, Branch and Joseph. That is the starting defensive backs they projected at the start of the season.

The big difference from this season from last is they are getting elite production from the safety position. Last year they didn't, when you have good safety production, it helps you still play man even if you are running out Dorsey and Vildor.

[Sanders Fan]

I’m actually not that worried about the defense now that they have Smith.

[whatever_gong82]

Lions film review: Why defense didn't sustain first-half success and explaining PFF's harsh grade of Arnold

Justin Rogers
Nov 30



Allen Park — As a young reporter, you best believe I used a Dickensian lede a time or two, so I’ll spare you the “best of halves, worst of halves” trope this time. Or did I find the perfect loophole for its utilization through self-deprecation?

Regardless, when it comes to the Detroit Lions’ defensive performance on Thursday, you understand why the cliche was on the brain. The unit almost made it through two quarters without surrendering a first down before conceding a dam-breaking completion with 55 seconds remaining in the half.


After the break, the Chicago Bears found the end zone three of their first four possessions, and despite being pinned at their 1-yard line on the fifth and final series, they worked into range for a potential tying field goal or game-winning touchdown before being undone by a series of self-inflicted miscues.


It’s the perfect setup for this week’s film study. We’ll focus on the drive-ending plays from the first half contrasted against the drive-extending plays of the second to better understand how the Lions let the Bears back into a game.

We’ll also explore rookie cornerback Terrion Arnold's day, more specifically evaluating his Pro Football Focus grade, which was among the roster’s worst despite allowing two catches for 20 yards on eight targets.


Best of times

After conceding a 6-yard check-down to running back D’Andre Swift on the game’s opening snap, the defense got the Bears in third-and-5 with excellent run defense on second down. Linebacker David Long Jr., who got the start in his second game with the Lions, shot his gap at the snap, causing Swift to slow his feet in the backfield, where he was dropped by defensive end Josh Paschal, coming from the backside of the zone concept.

On the third-down play, Chicago identified Detroit’s intent to play man coverage through pre-snap motion. To attack the Cover-1 look, they ran a clear-out wheel route for DJ Moore from the right slot.


But the secondary was up to the task as nickel corner Amik Robertson stayed tight with inside leverage on the receiver, while deep safety Kerby Joseph showed the range to get from the middle of the field to the sideline, triggering that direction before the ball left quarterback Caleb Williams’ hand.

That read allowed Joseph to arrive at the spot before the ball, resulting in a violent collision with Moore as the pass arrived.


The Bears again managed to pick up 6 yards on the first play of their second drive, this time on the ground. Failing to secure the edge, Swift was able to scoot around the left side of the formation for the gain.


But more strong play on second down, with cornerback Kindle Vildor firing downhill and tripping up Moore for no gain on a receiver screen, set up another passing situation on third down. The situation became a difficult-to-manage third-and-14 after a blatant offensive pass interference infraction by tight end Cole Kmet.

This time, the Lions opted for what appeared to be Cover-6 (half-field zone) to cloud Williams’ deeper looks. Rushing just four, Za’Darius Smith came from an inside alignment and blew by guard Teven Jenkins with a wicked spin move, flushing Williams from the pocket and leading to a throwaway.


Williams, who set the record for most consecutive passes by a rookie quarterback without an interception on Thursday, almost fell short of the mark when he put a second ball in danger early, directly throwing one at Arnold. The QB was bailed out by Moore, who converted to a defender, reaching over the corner's shoulder and knocking it away.


On third-and-6, the Lions mixed it up again, playing a well-disguised Cover-2, which looked like Cover-1 press before the snap. The rush was key to the stop with defensive end Al-Quadin Muhammad jarring back the right tackle with a bull rush before quickly shedding the blocker to force Williams to bail.

The QB had Rome Odunze come open while scrambling, but because Williams couldn’t square his shoulders while rolling left, the throw sailed wide of the target.


The Bears remained effective on first down during their fourth possession, gaining 7 yards on a check-down to Kmet where Long arrived a half-step too late to disrupt the pass.

But Muhammad drew a hold on the next snap to put the visitors behind the sticks, once again. Facing third-and-13 after a blitz-induced incompletion on the replay of second down, Williams couldn’t find anything open against Detroit’s Cover-3. With his pocket condensing, the QB bolted and managed to gain 10 before he was forced out of bounds by linebacker Jack Campbell.


Instead of punting again, Chicago opted to go for it on fourth-and-3 from their own 37. Detroit countered with Cover-1, which included a slick assignment switch between Arnold and Branch to blanket Moore’s shallow cross.

Williams initially looked to the crosser before firing to Swift, running a wheel route from the backfield down the right sideline. But the back was well-covered by linebacker Malcolm Rodriguez, who was initially set to blitz had Swift stayed in protection before redirecting into coverage. And while the linebacker never got his head around on the throw, he was so tight on the route the underthrown ball hit the defender in the back for the drive-ending PBU.


Taking over after Jahmyr Gibbs’ fumble in the red zone, the Bears finally mustered a first down in the closing minute of the half when Kmet found space in Detroit’s zone coverage for a 14-yard gain. They moved the chains again thanks to a cheap illegal contact penalty called against Campbell, but never threatened to score before the break.


Worst of times

Still, the momentum, if you believe in such a thing, carried into the third quarter. Taking the opening kickoff of the half, the Bears ran Swift three consecutive times, taking advantage of a defensive front that lost Paschal and Levi Onwuzurike to injuries in the second frame. Two of the three carries ran at undersized rookie defensive tackle Mekhi Wingo, who was pushed out of his gap.

But the Lions looked to have the series under control when an effective blitz by Campbell on the ensuing first down resulted in a cleanup sack for DJ Reader and Williams misfired low and wide on a spot route for Moore on second down, setting up third-and-14.


But unlike the first half, Detroit’s rush was unable to get home on the snap. Williams bobbed in his pocket for more than six seconds as Detroit’s Cover 3 zone started to crumble. That allowed Keenan Allen to wander into vacant space for an 18-yard conversion.

Assigning blame for the back-end breakdown is difficult without knowing Detroit's rules, although Joseph seemed to recognize the need to adjust, but was sluggish driving down on the receiver, putting him a step shy of being able to make a play on the ball.


Three plays later, the deep coverage crumbled once again. The Lions appear to be in Cover-4 and Joseph is drawn out of position by crossing vertical routes to the left. That allowed Allen to split the safeties on the post pattern for the 31-yard touchdown.


Chicago found their way back into the end zone with their next possession, driving 70 yards with eight plays. Most of the damage came on the first two snaps when Joseph had another coverage bust, resulting in a 19-yard pass to Moore, followed by Smith missing an early tackle on a screen to Swift that turned into a 29-yard gain.


The Bears moved into the red zone after Robertson was appropriately flagged for defensive holding after hooking the waist of Allen on a vertical release, and Arnold was bested in man coverage by Odunze running a short out route on third-and-6, setting up first-and-goal from the 9.

Two snaps later, Allen put Robertson in a blender with a spectacular, double-move slant from the right slot for an easy six.


Detroit briefly got back on track with a three-and-out their next series, but only because Moore dropped a third-down pass that was slightly behind him across the middle.


The “success” was short-lived as the Bears put together another march midway through the fourth quarter to slice Detroit’s lead to three.


The drive was an uncharacteristically rough one for Branch, who has been Detroit’s defensive MVP this season. Playing soft man coverage in the early stages of the posssession, the safety was beaten by Kmet on a short out route for 5 yards, converting third-and-4.

That set up another man-to-man loss where Moore got inside leverage and blew by Branch on the route release from the left slot before angling the go route toward the sideline for a 31-yard score.



Chicago had a chance to tie the game or take the lead with a late touchdown, digging out of a difficult hole after being pinned at their 1-yard line. They did so with dueling shallow crosses on third down that provided a natural pick for Allen to shake the coverage of Khalil Dorsey for a 25-yard gain.

The Bears continued to work down the field with a 14-yard curl to Moore, one of Vildor’s only coverage losses of the afternoon, and a 13-yard scramble for Williams.


Still, the Lions got the opponent in fourth-and-short, and when the Bears tried the dueling crossers a second time, Kmet was flagged for a blatant offensive pass interference for lunging into the pick.

That set a fourth-and-14 where the Bears were bailed out by a defensive pass interference call against Vildor on a desperation heave from Williams, who was under heavy pressure from linebacker Trevor Nowaske.


That flag put the Bears in field-goal range, but they were undone by four consecutive mistakes. A missed throw to a wide-open receiver on first down, a hands-to-the-face infraction on second down, failing to block Smith on the post-penalty snap, resulting in a sack, and the disastrous clock management to end the game.

Detroit did catch a break on Williams’ game-ending incompletion. Arnold slipped trying to mirror Odunze’s post-corner pattern, and Joseph was out of position to offer support. If the throw was better, it probably goes for a touchdown.



Was PFF fair to Arnold?

Arnold’s coverage on the final play is a good segue into an evaluation of his PFF grade, which was the third-lowest for Detroit’s defense.


It stuck out to me because I didn’t recall him giving up many catches during the live viewing, which was confirmed by their detailed statistics. They had him surrendering two receptions for 20 yards on eight targets. Seems pretty damn good, right?

But PFF doesn’t grade the result as much as the process. As a longtime subscriber to the publication — more for their counting stats (missed tackles, QB pressures, targets and receptions allowed) than their proprietary grading — I’m often intrigued and occasionally disagree with their analysis.


I made sure to focus on Arnold’s play and after taking in the film, I fully understand how PFF reached their conclusions.

Most of the lapses came in the second half. On the Bears’ first touchdown, for example, Arnold wasn’t targeted in coverage, but had been badly beaten by Odunze’s double-move on the outside and could have just as easily surrendered the touchdown if Williams targeted the rookie instead of Allen.


Similarly, Arnold was beaten on the post pattern that Moore dropped on third down in the third quarter. Admittedly, there might have been a push-off by the receiver, and the cornerback certainly lobbied the officials for one after the play, but since it wasn’t called, he’s docked for letting the receiver outmuscle him at the top of the route.

How about that misfire by Williams to kickstart the string of blunders to end the game? That throw was intended for Moore, who had destroyed the rookie defensive back with his release on the crosser.


And then we have the final play, where Arnold’s coverage wasn’t good enough and could have cost the Lions the game.

You love the final stat line, but it wasn't truly wasn't indicative of the performance. Arnold was left with a lot to clean up coming out of this one.


Concluding thoughts

*- Detroit got a lot out of its edge rushers in this one. Paschal was off to a hot start before an early injury, but Muhammad stepped in and delivered his best performance as a Lions, consistently giving the Bears offensive tackles trouble. Plus, Smith continues to be a solid addition. Outside of the missed tackle on the screen, he was consistently disruptive as a rusher and that was rewarded with the two sacks on the final series.


*- What a rebound performance for Vildor. After a rough outing against the Colts last weekend, the backup corner was sticky in coverage all afternoon against a talent Bears receiving corps.

*- DJ Reader isn’t known for his pass rush, but he gave Chicago’s interior problems beyond the two sacks. Along with Alim McNeil, Detroit’s interior did a good job taking away Williams’ ability to step up in the pocket much of the day.


*- Campbell keeps making incremental improvements. His pursuit angles coming downhill are consistently good, but he showed some of his best coverage awareness in this contest.

*- Long and Ezekiel Turner can be a little chaotic, but both play with relatively high instincts. There will be hiccups because of their newness to the scheme, but I feel like they can backfill some of Detroit’s injury woes at linebacker better than might be expected for two players who have been in the building less than a month.



Email: jrogers@detroitfootball.net

X: Justin_Rogers

Bluesky: Justin-Rogers

[whatever_gong82]

Detroit Lions CB Kindle Vildor has bounce-back game despite 'crazy' PI penalty

Paywall article.

Dave Birkett
Detroit Free Press



When Caleb Williams' final pass sailed incomplete, just over the head of Rome Odunze with no time on the clock in the Detroit Lions' Thanksgiving win over the Chicago Bears, the first thing Kindle Vildor did was look around for a penalty flag.

"I was hoping they didn’t call another crazy pass interference, that’s what I was hoping," the Lions cornerback told two reporters in the locker room after the game. "But shoot, I’m glad we was able to fight through adversity and get the victory."

Vildor's apprehension was understandable given he was flagged for a questionable pass interference penalty 46 seconds earlier that kept alive the Bears' final drive and their hopes of a holiday upset.



One of the goats of last year's NFC championship game loss to the San Francisco 49ers, when he had a long Brock Purdy pass bounce off his facemask for a completion to Brandon Aiyuk, Vildor made his second straight start at cornerback Thursday as the Lions continue to battle injuries on defense.

He allowed a 14-yard completion on second-and-15 on the Bears' final drive a few plays before his penalty, but also showed improvement after a rough start a week earlier against the Indianapolis Colts.


"We love the way he competes," Lions head coach Dan Campbell said. "You don’t worry about him, it’s too big for him, or he’s not going to go out there and he’s not going to fight the guy. We know exactly what he is, and we love it. We love who he is and the way he plays.”

Vildor and Khalil Dorsey split No. 2 cornerback reps Thursday as Carlton Davis III was out with thumb and knee injuries and Emmanuel Moseley suffered an injury in pregame warmups.


Both started the game, Campbell said, because the Lions benched Terrion Arnold for the opening drive to monitor his snaps in his return from a groin injury.

"We just wanted to make sure he was good," Campbell said. "Once we got him in there and saw him after the next possession, then he was good, and we let him go.”



Arnold was one of the Lions' worst-graded defenders Thursday by Pro Football Focus. He nearly got beat twice for touchdowns on the final drive, once on a crossing route to DJ Moore and again on the game's final play.

Vildor played as the Lions' second outside cornerback opposite Arnold for most of the game's final series, missing one play with an arm injury, when Dorsey got beat for a 25-yard gain on third-and-7. He was in deep coverage on Williams' fourth-and-14 heave to Moore when he was flagged for his second pass interference penalty of the season.


Vildor jammed Moore at the line of scrimmage, slowing his release, and was penalized for jostling for position downfield after Williams scrambled to buy time in the pocket.

"I was confused," Vildor said of the penalty. "Everybody gets called for pass interference, but right there, I didn’t really see anything, I didn’t do anything. It was crazy. The ref told me after the game, he said that he thought I was grabbing him as I was going back towards the ball. It was unbelievable for me, man, but we still won, so I ain’t even worried about it no more."


Campbell defended Vildor's coverage after the game.


"I didn’t have a problem with the coverage," he said. "That’s probably the best way to say it. I thought those guys were competing for the ball, and I liked his coverage there."

As stunned as he was at the flag, Vildor brushed off his bad fortune as he talked to reporters in the locker room. He started his career as a fifth-round pick with the Bears in 2020 and played three seasons with the team before being cut at the end of training camp last summer.


Vildor had brief stints with the Tennessee Titans and Philadelphia Eagles last year before joining the Lions at midseason, and a year later he couldn't ask to be in a better spot despite the bumps along the way.

“It’s crazy," he said. "I never been a part of nothing like it. It’s special right now, man. It’s a blessing to be a part of a team like this and just continue to ride the wave, just keep getting better and better and get to where we want to get to."



Dave Birkett will sign copies of his new book, "Detroit Lions: An Illustrated Timeline" at 7 p.m. Dec. 9 at Post Local Bistro in Plymouth.

Order your copy here.

Contact him at dbirkett@freepress.com. Follow him on Bluesky, X and Instagram at @davebirkett.

[Iron Lion]

[Coop]

Sometimes you need luck to win games, and we got lucky. Eberflus screwed the pooch and then tried to rationalize it and obviously he's gone now. When Gibbs fumbled near the end of the 2nd quarter I got that sinking feeling that this was going to be a tale of two halves, and it certainly seemed to play out that way. Bears figured out something defensively at halftime and it showed. The injuries just keep piling up on defense. Not sustainable. Jameson Williams has got to pull his head of of his a** and stop doing stupid s****. He's got rare talent but feels like he continues to shoot himself in the foot.