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  • On June 23, the Tigers were 32-41 but only 4 1/2 games behind the Twins for first place.

    The Tigers share MLB’s longest postseason drought with the Angels, so the narrative around manager A.J. Hinch’s mostly young team was more positive than one might imagine. Local reporters had been asking for days about the standings. And eventually, Hinch had heard enough. The manager who went to two World Series with the Houston Astros provided a dose of reality.

    “I’m just not going to let our team talk (about contending or the standings),” Hinch said. “I haven’t heard those words. … I don’t want to hear it, because I think we have so much more to do to get better before we can truthfully talk like that. We haven’t earned the right to talk that way. We just haven’t.”

    The straight answer turned into something of a rant.

    “You want to get somewhere where you matter and you want to get on national broadcasts? You want to get into the conversation where people don’t look at us like, pat us on the head, we’re a nice team that’s trying hard?” Hinch said. “Play better. Play better for a long time, beat some teams, and then you’ll start to earn that designation. Until then, it’s all a distraction.”

    For what it’s worth, the series opener this weekend between Detroit and Cleveland was slated to be aired on FOX before it was rained out, though that might have more to do with the Hollywood writer’s strike than with the national allure of a midweek matchup between a couple of teams jostling for second place in baseball’s weakest division.

    The Tigers are now 7 1/2 games out of first place (actually closer to the Guardians than the Guardians are to the Twins). That the Tigers are lurking just behind Cleveland for second place is a testament to the nature of the division’s top and bottom rungs.

    Once viewed as the future powers of the division, the White Sox had slumped to a miserable 49-75 record and traded key players such as starter Lucas Giolito at the trade deadline. First-year manager Pedro Grifol has struggled to tame clubhouse issues that dated to the team’s ill-fated two seasons with Tony La Russa as manager. After relief pitcher Kenyan Middleton was traded to the Yankees, he did an interview with ESPN in which he ripped the White Sox culture.


    In Kansas City, a season of atrocious play has highlighted how far the organization has to go in the first year with J.J. Picollo as the president of baseball operations and Matt Quatraro as manager.

    These are teams stuck in place, treading water far from shore, neither clearly trending up nor obviously tanking in the style of the Astros. In a division of failed rebuilds and sustained mediocrity, this year’s heightened struggles could be attributed to MLB’s move to a balanced schedule before the season. Teams now face each of the 29 other teams at least once during the year. As a result, teams now play only 52 games against division opponents. In previous years, they played 76.

    The Tigers just so happen to have a 25-15 record against division opponents this season, on track for the team’s first winning record against AL Central rivals since 2016. “The way we’re playing the Central, I wish we played more in the Central,” Hinch said Sunday in Cleveland. “Is that where you’re going with this?”

    Later Sunday afternoon, Eduardo Rodriguez — the pitcher who cited personal reasons and nixed a trade to the contending Dodgers at the deadline — went 6 2/3 innings in a 4-1 victory, leading Detroit back into the fringe of the division hunt.

    “I don’t feel we’re out yet,” Rodriguez had told reporters before his previous start. “We have a chance to make the postseason. That’s why I decided to stay here, too. Right now I just want to keep pitching and keep helping my team. I hope we can make it.”

    Detroit, though, is 32-52 against the rest of the league, including a disheartening 5-20 against baseball’s strongest division, the AL East.

    “The reality is you have to play well against the whole league now to win your division,” Hinch said. “Whether it’s an anomaly or whether there’s something to it, this year shows us it’s great we’ve played well in the division, but the AL East has not been kind to us, other divisions have not been kind to us.”


    Sunday in Minnesota, the Twins handed the ball to another pitcher on his last legs.

    Dallas Keuchel — a former Cy Young winner whose fastball now averages 87 mph, a bearded left-hander who had not struck out any of the 36 batters he had faced as a member of the Twins — started against the Pirates.

    The 35-year-old Keuchel, however, spun what might be one of his last gems in the major leagues. He was perfect through 6 1/3 innings in a 2-0 victory, allowing the Twins to retain a six-game hold on the division. At 65-60, the Twins could challenge the 2005 Padres (82-80) for fewest wins from a division champion. With the Tigers and the Guardians playing one another this weekend, the division overall managed an 8-9 record, that .470 winning percentage representing something of a banner stretch.


    The AL Central lives at the intersection of absurd and hapless, as evidenced by Keuchel’s improbable outing and another play that unfolded on the shores of Lake Erie on Sunday.

    In the top of the second, Detroit’s Matt Vierling tapped a ball down the third-base line. Cleveland’s Logan Allen and Tyler Freeman converged on the ball, let it trickle down the line, praying it would roll foul.

    The ball came to a complete stop on the chalk … a base hit, and yet another reminder of the state of the game, the series, and the season in the AL Central: slow-moving, non-developing, anticlimactic, a bunch of stoppable forces meeting some movable objects.



    Last edited by whatever_gong82; August 22, 2023, 10:11 AM.
    "I hope to see the Lions in the Super Bowl before I die"
    My friend Ken L

    Comment


    • Originally posted by chemiclord View Post
      I think the problem is where expectations are at.
      If the low expectations are on the GM that's been here 6 months, that's on the fan.

      Comment


      • Tigers came back to beat the Cubbies at home, 8-6 tonight.

        Ibanez had 2 home runs, one of which was a 3-run bomb against former Tiger Drew Smyly, who took the loss.
        "I hope to see the Lions in the Super Bowl before I die"
        My friend Ken L

        Comment


        • Scott Harris does deserve the benefit of the doubt, but let's not kid ourselves, part of the issue of where the Tigers got themselves is the low expectations of the fans and media during the Avila era. It was clear for a long time that the franchise was adrift but if you pointed it out, you were being the turd in the punch bowl. It was basically years of telling people not to pay attention to the shit product at the major league level because they were building something in the minor leagues. It was a flim flam scheme, you have to build at the major league level even if you are trying to rebuild the farm system.

          Harris doesn't deserve a lot of criticism for this season, but he should be on the clock for next season. He has some young pieces to work with, he needs to go out and get upgrades to help those young pieces out. It seems like he is implementing the philosophy to transform the organization so they can develop players and acquire players that fit a specific skillet that was lacking even during the DD glory years. That shit means a hill of beans if you can't find ways to at least be .500.

          Hovering around 10 games under in a wretched division deserves criticism. It kind of gets offset because they had a fake pennant chase that masked the reality of having another 90 loss year.

          Comment


          • Update on the Tigers, I am eating a huge plate of crow because the Tigers got over 75 wins this year. Whitley was right, I was wrong. The franchise is showing signs of life. They punched above their weight record wise, their run differential suggested a 73 win team but they got to 78. They improved defensively, on the basepaths and in the bullpen.

            I like what they are doing with the pitching staff, they are able to find average pitchers and use them in middle relief roles. Tyler Holton was a revelation this season 85 innings, a 2.11 ERA with a war at 3. It sounds like they are going to try to have a couple more guys do the Holton role.

            Time to compete for the division next season.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by froot loops View Post
              Update on the Tigers, I am eating a huge plate of crow because the Tigers got over 75 wins this year. Whitley was right, I was wrong. The franchise is showing signs of life. They punched above their weight record wise, their run differential suggested a 73 win team but they got to 78. They improved defensively, on the basepaths and in the bullpen.

              I like what they are doing with the pitching staff, they are able to find average pitchers and use them in middle relief roles. Tyler Holton was a revelation this season 85 innings, a 2.11 ERA with a war at 3. It sounds like they are going to try to have a couple more guys do the Holton role.

              Time to compete for the division next season.
              I'm still agnostic on the Tigers. Until Chris Ilitch proves to me that he wants to win and have people that know what they're doing, I'm apathetic towards the team.

              They also got rid of the TV announcer, Shep what his name.

              Ever since the 2 guys awhile back getting into a fight, the TV booth has been gosh awful.
              "I hope to see the Lions in the Super Bowl before I die"
              My friend Ken L

              Comment


              • Being agnostic is probably the right move, but I was impressed with some of the stuff that the Tigers did. I was highly skeptical of Hinch, but he did better this year. They looked a lot more sound and we are starting to see good fundamental baseball. So I have more confidence in this crew than the Avila crew.

                We will see this off-season about if they are willing to acquire some players.

                Comment


                • AJ Hinch deserves a lot of credit for the 78 wins this year. He should (but won't) get some down ballot MOY votes.


                  The Tigers need a leadoff hitter. They have to improve 2b, 3b and DH for next year. FA on the hitting side is awful outside of Ohtani and Chapman.

                  Given the kind of hitter Harris seems to like ...I think W Merrifield and Jorge Polanco (if the Twins don't exercise their option on him ) would be awfully nice additions.

                  Merrifield can play 2/of/DH. Polanco 2/3. Those two would allow the Tigers to hedge their bets on Keith and JHM. If Keith can handle 3b defensively move Polanco to 2b and Merrifield to DH. If Malloy can hit but needs to DH most days you still play Merrifield at 2b. If both are ready defensively....then the Tigers bench got a lot deeper.



                  ​​​​
                  2012 Detroit Lions Draft: 1) Cordy Glenn G , 2) Brandon Taylor S, 3) Sean Spence olb, 4) Joe Adams WR/KR, 5) Matt McCants OT, 7a) B.J. Coleman QB 7b) Kewshan Martin WR

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by whatever_gong82 View Post

                    I'm still agnostic on the Tigers. Until Chris Ilitch proves to me that he wants to win and have people that know what they're doing, I'm apathetic towards the team.

                    They also got rid of the TV announcer, Shep what his name.

                    Ever since the 2 guys awhile back getting into a fight, the TV booth has been gosh awful.
                    I agreed with Froot that the team is better than I imagined it would be but I just don’t know if Ilitch actually wants to win. They’ll need to start spending
                    F#*K OHIO!!!

                    You're not only an amazingly beautiful man, but you're the greatest football mind to ever exist. <-- Jeffy Shittypants actually posted this. I knew he was in love with me.

                    Comment


                    • TIgers vs division: 35-17
                      vs rest of league 43-67

                      So how much of the success is because of the awful division? I guess if nothing else they dont have to improve much to challenge for the division anyway.

                      Comment


                      • If they still had the unbalanced schedule they would have been over .500.

                        They actually don't need to go all out in free agency this year. They have some young pieces for once and the farm system actually did something this year. A couple position players and probably a pitcher if Rodriguez opts out. I trust Harris to get more done in free agency than Avila. The two times Avila was allowed to spend, it screwed up the team with bad players with bad contracts.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by froot loops View Post
                          If they still had the unbalanced schedule they would have been over .500.

                          They actually don't need to go all out in free agency this year. They have some young pieces for once and the farm system actually did something this year. A couple position players and probably a pitcher if Rodriguez opts out. I trust Harris to get more done in free agency than Avila. The two times Avila was allowed to spend, it screwed up the team with bad players with bad contracts.
                          We shall see in this upcoming offseason what Mr. Harris does.

                          I hope that you're right about him. The last thing we need is Randy Smith 3.0, after dealing with the inept 2.0 in Avila, along with the original 1.0 in Randy Smith himself.

                          I still can't believe that it's been 21 years since former Tigers President Dave Dombrowski got rid of that Millen-like clown.
                          "I hope to see the Lions in the Super Bowl before I die"
                          My friend Ken L

                          Comment


                          • They don't have to go crazy, but they can't exactly stay pat, either.

                            We'll see if Chris I. allows Harris to do anything with the savings that'll come with Cabrera's contract off the books. I'm not hopeful.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by chemiclord View Post
                              They don't have to crazy, but they can't exactly stay pat, either.

                              We'll see if Chris I. allows Harris to do anything with the savings that'll come with Cabrera's contract off the books. I'm not hopeful.
                              Same.

                              We both remember that he was in charge with Randy Smith a little over 2 decades ago, and we saw what a shit show that was.

                              And since his dad died, this franchise has been a shit show again.

                              If he doesn't want to play with the big boys, or at least be creative like Tampa Bay and Houston (while adding a good budget like Houston's), then he needs to sell the team.
                              "I hope to see the Lions in the Super Bowl before I die"
                              My friend Ken L

                              Comment


                              • I don't know if Harris is going to be version 3.0 of those goofs, but we've seen some encouraging signs in year one that he might not be. He was able to find cheap guys who were plus players in Ibanez, Holton, Vierling and McKinstry. Avila hung his hat on finding JD Martinez and seemingly never found another player.

                                The farm system is also starting to show signs of life. One of the frustrating things about the Tigers is they would always talk big about transforming the development system, but it was all talk and the stuff they talked about never showed on the field. They are supposedly building a development center in the Dominican Republic, I guess that is better late than never.

                                I've always said spend, spend, spend because organizationally they have been failures in development and finding talent. One of the big disappointments with Dombrowski was he was known as a farm builder when he was hired. That never came to fruition as his farm development was solely spending over slot on 1st rounds picks that hit big time.

                                We will see how Harris does in his second off-season but I was impressed with what I saw during the season. I think this free agent class is poor for the big ticket items, but maybe he finds some guys.

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