Coronavirus Safety Protocol - please read and discuss

[froot loops]

So Occam's Razor changed? You are fooling yourself if you think only the Chinese would stonewall and slow play investigations.

[TheLondonLion]

More facts emerged.

Horseshoe bats aren’t found in Wuhan or anywhere near - so why didn’t we see outbreaks of a highly infectious disease along the supply chain to Wuhan? Why has no intermediary animal been found?

Why did leading scientists say in private correspondence that it was likely a lab escape and then publish an article days later saying it came from nature to protect “Chinese science”? They’re questions that should be asked.

An email from Sir Jeremy Farrar, director of the Wellcome Trust, on February 2 2020 said that “a likely explanation” was that Covid had rapidly evolved from a Sars-like virus inside human tissue in a low-security lab.

The email, to Dr Anthony Fauci and Dr Francis Collins of the US National Institutes of Health, went on to say that such evolution may have “accidentally created a virus primed for rapid transmission between humans”.

But a leading scientist told Sir Jeremy that “further debate would do unnecessary harm to science in general and science in China in particular”. Dr Collins, the former director of the US National Institutes of Health, warned it could damage “international harmony”.

This came out yesterday and in my opinion it stinks.

[froot loops]

How those fellas funded?

[TheLondonLion]

Good question - another one that should be asked, but isn’t.

Some of the grants for the research in China was coming from the NIH - good luck getting any accountability for the investment though.

On Wednesday, the NIH sent a letter to members of the House Committee on Energy and Commerce that acknowledged two facts. One was that EcoHealth Alliance, a New York City–based nonprofit that partners with far-flung laboratories to research and prevent the outbreak of emerging diseases, did indeed enhance a bat coronavirus to become potentially more infectious to humans, which the NIH letter described as an “unexpected result” of the research it funded that was carried out in partnership with the Wuhan Institute of Virology. The second was that EcoHealth Alliance violated the terms of its grant conditions stipulating that it had to report if its research increased the viral growth of a pathogen by tenfold.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.van...h-in-wuhan/amp

[froot loops]

You should be asking the questions before you take their word as gospel, learn from your first Occam's Razor argument. The problem a lot of you guys and fellas like Doctors Joe Rogan and Donald Trump Junior is you read a few charged articles and all of a sudden you are an epidemiologist.

I don't know where it came from, I don't particularly care. Scouring the internet to get outraged is not my cup of tea.

[TheLondonLion]

I care because unless you know where it came from, you can’t learn any lessons to prevent it happening again. And it’s killed 4-5 million people and wiped trillions off the global economy.

You don’t have to be an epidemiologist to see that the co-incidence, in combination with the behaviour of the Chinese government is beyond suspicious.

Please don’t ever group me with Joe Rogan and Donald Trump Jr again.

[Futureshock]

The truthg of the matter, and this will not make you feel any better TLL, is there are a bunch of contaminants that could kill us at any time without us knowing what hit us.

For instance one example that comes to mind is when I used to work as an Occupational Safety Manager for a municipality. We have a Sewage Treatment plant that treats effluent with chemicals before it is released back into the surface water.

Well, in this process some of the chemicals that are directly introduced in the cleaning stage (where it does it's job and is somewhat harmless) under water are extremely dangerous when released in the air. One pin hole sized leak in the above surface piping could caused 100k people or more to die within minutes. Depending on the which way the wind blows.

But that, and many other things are always out there and around us.

[TheLondonLion]

Oh yeah, I agree.

That’s why I think science regulating itself (and covering up for itself) can be extremely dangerous.

I’d first of all like to know what caused this - and that involves far more international pressure being ratcheted up on China (who are currently claiming it came from the US - again, indicative of guilt).

At the moment no one is really asking questions, we’ve just accepted this as normal. But it isn’t normal.

The big issue is “gain of function” research, where viruses are souped up with human cells to be studied. Is the “juice” of this kind of research worth the squeeze, when an escape can cause a horrendous pandemic? It’s an ethical issue I’d like fo see addressed.

Fauci has questions to answer on this subject, in my opinion. Obama banned this kind of research in the US, so it appears to have been outsourced to China where there is no oversight, per State Department cables from two years previous the lab had been flagged as a safety risk and then they shut up shop to stonewall inquiries.

As it stands, we’re doing nothing to protect ourselves from the outbreak of future pandemics (whether or was from “nature” or the lab) because we have no confirmation of the cause.

[foxhopper]

And don't start piling on LondonLion because I have liked a couple of his recent posts. He hasn't joined me on the dark scary evil side. He has real and legitimate questions that need fucking open discussion and answers. Good for him. There may be hope for a few of you.

[TheLondonLion]

The world needs answers. It’s incredible to me that we’re just going to shrug when a novel disease has set the world on fire, killing millions, costing millions of people their businesses and livelihoods and sending inflation through the roof while emptying shelves - and no one is really asking why. We’re just going to accept this fell out of the sky with no evidence?

It should be the single biggest priority behind saving lives now.


Apparently to leading scientists (including Fauci), protecting “Chinese science” and “international harmony” is more important than the truth. That doesn’t sound very scientific to me.

[Futureshock]

I'd have to agree with you there.

It is also not the scientific method to not delve into the origin. If it were, there should be major ramifications

[chemiclord]

"Falling out of the sky" is pretty much EXACTLY how novel viruses happen. Two bits of radical RNA get all twisted up, it jumps to a different species, and happens to be compatible, and adds new RNA to the viral mix.

The people who are so twisted up in "how this happened" tend to have an agenda; that agenda being blaming China for what was most likely something that could have happened anywhere species intermingle in close contact in significant numbers. Hell, it could have just as easily been a goddamn street in New Dehli or a farmer's market in Podunk, Kansas.

They want an excuse to get the fight they want, and COVID-19 is merely their latest attempt to instigate one.

[TheLondonLion]

I thought science was testing hypotheses - not dismissing them because it’s politically expedient or playing amateur diplomat.

There are huge conflicts of interest, from Fauci’s NIH funding this kind of dangerous research in China to the guy who shut down all discussion of the lab leak and was the only American on the first WHO inquiry…who turned out to be one of the lab’s closest and longest partners.

The whole thing stinks of being the biggest cover up of all time from where I’m standing. I realize talking about it on a Lions forum probably isn’t going to get us the answers, but I feel strongly that we aren’t asking questions of huge importance to humanity.

[TheLondonLion]

"Falling out of the sky" is pretty much EXACTLY how novel viruses happen. Two bits of radical RNA get all twisted up, it jumps to a different species, and happens to be compatible, and adds new RNA to the viral mix.

The people who are so twisted up in "how this happened" tend to have an agenda; that agenda being blaming China for what was most likely something that could have happened anywhere species intermingle in close contact in significant numbers. Hell, it could have just as easily been a goddamn street in New Dehli or a farmer's market in Podunk, Kansas.

They want an excuse to get the fight they want, and COVID-19 is merely their latest attempt to instigate one.

Most viruses aren’t perfectly primed to attack humans from the get go. This one was.

SARs rapidly mutated as it adapted to it’s new human hosts after the zoonotic jump. There’s a reason that zoonotic diseases don’t tend to explode like this one has - SARs for example blew out quickly before it became a pandemic.

The question is why this one was so different - and why it happened to emerge in the same city as the largest bat coronavirus lab on earth running gain of function experiments on bat coronaviruses to make them highly infectious in humans.

They literally explained how they did it and had a grant denied by the NIH for being too dangerous. That’s the same guy who dismissed the lab leak hypothesis as a conspiracy theory, btw.

https://theintercept.com/2021/09/23/...h-grant-darpa/

[chemiclord]

It's more that I tend to dismiss conspiracy theories when a perfectly plausible NON-conspiracy theory can explain the events in question.

Nothing SARS-COV-2 (or any of its variants) has demonstrated suggests it's particularly different than any other novel virus that has emerged since recorded history; a viral cross-species mutation like pretty much every severe influenza strain, or a virus like HIV.

Meanwhile, the "lab leak" theory requires THOUSANDS of people across multiple countries coordinating answers over the span of the last two years, and never slipping up ONCE or the whole house of cards collapses. Mind you, we've had conspiracies collapse out of seeming inane shit like a dude standing on the wrong street corner (Watergate), and that involved like... nine people, iirc.

Humans simply aren't very good at conspiracies, never have been, and probably never will be. The sheer numbers required to keep something like this secret for even more than a few weeks make it highly implausible at best.

Barring some pretty damn compelling evidence that something sinister is actually afoot, the simplest (and most likely) answer is that SARS-COV-2 is like every other novel virus that has come about... quite literally "falling from the sky."