DetroitLionsForum.com
Please support the forum by using this link to shop with our sponsor:

Go Back   DetroitLionsForum.com > Sports Discussion Forums > University of Michigan

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old April 15th, 2017, 06:51 AM   #1
Jeff Buchanan
Senior Member
 
Jeff Buchanan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,416
Michigan @ Michigan, 1:15p, BTN, 3h Delay (Spring Game)

There's a good breakdown of the key things to watch at mgoblog that makes for good Saturday morning coffee and reading.

http://mgoblog.com/

For me it's the JOK v. Brandon Peters contest, Mason Cole not getting trucked by Rashan Gary, JBB being serviceable against Don Brown testing him and is DPJ looking like a starter at WR.

Also ..... is Kaleke Hudson even 80% of Peppers?

Enjoy.
__________________
On Harbaugh's expectations for M football in 2015 (NFL NETWORK): “We'd rather be about it than talk about it."
Jeff Buchanan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 07:20 AM   #2
Cody_Russell
Senior Member
 
Cody_Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 11,412
Yay!
I'm excited to see a bigger Chase Winovich and how he looks at DE opposite Gary.
Gary and Peters in year 2 too. Should be fun.
__________________
Go Detroit Lions!
Cody_Russell is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 10:06 AM   #3
Detroit Dan
Senior Member
 
Detroit Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Detroit
Posts: 3,378
I'll watch at 3pm, listen on radio at 1pm.
Detroit Dan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 03:17 PM   #4
WingsFan
Senior Member
 
WingsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ann Arbor MI
Posts: 8,490
Speight still can't get rid of the freaking ball. My god. Plz Jim just go with Peters
WingsFan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 03:50 PM   #5
Cody_Russell
Senior Member
 
Cody_Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 11,412
Speight was lucky not to have 2 INTs in this game. I think it was Hudson that dropped an INT.
Looks like any improvement in the offseason is marginal, if anything, for Speight.
Not too excited about him.

Whereas Peters... he'll make some mistakes due to inexperience, but I love his ceiling.

EDIT: lucky not to have 3 INTs. I should have finished the game lol
__________________
Go Detroit Lions!

Last edited by Cody_Russell; April 15th, 2017 at 04:00 PM.
Cody_Russell is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 06:19 PM   #6
WingsFan
Senior Member
 
WingsFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ann Arbor MI
Posts: 8,490
WingsFan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 07:31 PM   #7
Jeff Buchanan
Senior Member
 
Jeff Buchanan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,416
I still haven't seen the complete game but .....

For me it's the JOK v. Brandon Peters contest ...... Peters with a wide lead over JOK and ....... Wilton Speight. Wilton reportedly looked bad and not at all improved from 2106. Saving grace: he played against Brown's 1s but still.

Modern day defenses - and by this I mean the kinds of defenses being fielded at the college level in the last 3-5 years - look a lot like 4-2-5s. The backers are fast and agile between the sidelines and you've got speed rushers up front like Gary and Hurst with big meat at DT as run stoppers; follow that with instinctive Vipers, or whatever you want to call the Peppers, now K. Hudson types, and QBs without legs are toast. That's Speight.

Speight is going to be fine against the bottom half of the BT where he's got time to set and and throw. He's going to be easy prey for the top D's both in the BT and outside of it.

Mason Cole not getting trucked by Rashan Gary ...... from what I saw in clips and reading posts at mgoblog is that Gary beat up on JBB. Cole held his own but I'm not sure agasint who. Owenwu did not garner a lot of praise. OL, as expected, a work in progress.

JBB being serviceable against Don Brown testing him ..... JBB had limited snaps from what I can tell and Runyan was at his MAC level best at RT.

and is DPJ looking like a starter at WR....... from what I saw and read, Tarik Black is the man. Way early but the WR position looks solid.

Caveat ..... spring game.
__________________
On Harbaugh's expectations for M football in 2015 (NFL NETWORK): “We'd rather be about it than talk about it."
Jeff Buchanan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 10:38 PM   #8
Pasadena Blue
Senior Member
 
Pasadena Blue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,335
Players I was impressed by: Khaleke Hudson, Brandon Peters, Tarik Black, Devin Bush (though easy to look good on A-gap blitzes when no one is blocking)

Players who mostly sucked: Nate Johnson, Wilton Speight.

It's time for JH to stop saying Wiliton's in the lead ... time to start seriously grooming Peters to take over next year.
Pasadena Blue is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 15th, 2017, 11:02 PM   #9
Pasadena Blue
Senior Member
 
Pasadena Blue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,335
I feel like the Michigan coaches got a lot of answers (at least as many as they could have hoped for) after this Spring game.

I really think it has to be Peters at QB ... time to pull the plug on Speight.
Khalid Hill looks even better at FB after dropping the weight.
RB has to be by rotation. I think Evans and Higdon are a wash at #1, Isaacs is a good change of pace, and I think Walker is still on the outside looking in.

Tarik Black looks to be the real deal at WR. I would pencil him and DPG as starters. Crawford and McDoom may be fighting for the slot. The older guys: Ways, Harris, and Perry (if he can even get past the legal stuff) are probably pushed aside. Oliver Martin may be forced to redshirt with this type of depth.

TW should be the starter at TE. Gentry and/or Eubanks in on 2 TE sets.

For the OL -- only the RT position is unsettled.
LT-Cole
LG-Bredeson
Center - Kugler
RG - Onwenu
RT -- JBB --- but hoping Filiaga comes in and proves to be a monster. Otherwise we'll need at TE on JBB's side every time


On D --- I think the starters are set, but still muddy on the back-up's -- esp on the D-line rotation.

D-Line: Gary, Hurst, Mone, Winovich
SAM: McCray
MLB: Bush
Viper: Hudson
Safeties: Kinnel, Metellus
CB: Long, Hill


This is going to be an athletic and solid team --- our ceiling will depend on whether JH goes all in Peters now, or tries to got the well again with Speight --- I'm hoping for the former.
Pasadena Blue is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 16th, 2017, 09:07 AM   #10
Rocky Bleier
Senior Member
 
Rocky Bleier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Northwest, WI
Posts: 9,195
Speight has just about reached his ceiling. He looked the same, which is to say very shaky. We definitely need to get a dual-threat QB.
__________________
I'll let you ban hate speech when you let me define hate speech.
Rocky Bleier is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 16th, 2017, 09:54 AM   #11
Cody_Russell
Senior Member
 
Cody_Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 11,412
Quinn Nordin has a lot of power as a kicker too. 60 yard potential one day...
For some reason, I thought Nordin attempted a kick in the Wisconsin game last season... but that was some guy named Ryan Tice.
__________________
Go Detroit Lions!
Cody_Russell is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 16th, 2017, 06:29 PM   #12
Jeff Buchanan
Senior Member
 
Jeff Buchanan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,416
I watched most of the game streamed on the BTN.

I'd like a play by play on this and I lost count, but Speight seemed to face an unblocked free rusher a lot more than Peters did. Was that on purpose? i.e., was Brown holding back for Peters and letting Speight work on dealing with a speed rush?

Two points: (1) Speight made some bad throws under pressure (a continuing problem). (2) This may be the best DL in the nation. The back side isn't bad either. I saw more contested throws than easy ones with Speight in there and facing the 1s on D.

The Double A gap blitz is tough on QBs ....... and offensive lines. Against the blitz the OL did poorly and there was zero pick-ups of those blitzes by RBs (some of that was formation or RPS). If you watch Brady or Big Ben run plays out of the shortgun (pistol as the case may be), their OLs are virtually impenetrable and if there's a RB back there they'll consistently pick up free blitzers.

Peters has a beautiful throwing motion. I didn't think his release was super quick but its probably 1.5 - 2 seconds quicker that Speight's. He's a classic drop back QB but has a lot of mobility - I think somebody pointed out a while back that he ran a good deal out of a RO offense in HS.

Seight had one really nice long ball to Black that was tipped by Washington coming over from out of nowhere to put three defenders on Black. Without that tip by Washington, Black high points it for a spectacular catch and were talking about Speight's improved long ball. It was right where it was supposed to be - nice arc, just outside Black's outside shoulder and had he been open and not perfectly covered under and over, it would have been in stride and gone for a TD.

I counted two Read Option plays both of them went for 10+ yards. I can't remember who carried. But it was zone blocking and done really well. The RO plays are all Frey.
It wasn't Isaac running the ball but he had two really nice runs. The long TD run was a power inside run with Bredenson pulling from his LG position and leading the way.

The bread and butter pass play in Harbaughffense remains several plays to the TEs who were blindingly open when they were made. I think the McDoom reverse should be eliminated from the play book. That play is getting so routinely hammered it's not worth a wasted down.

In a word, if the starters remain the starters on D and stay healthy, there will be no drop off on M's D from 2016. I like what I think Brown is doing with K Hudson. He just plays the Viper role from the same myriad positions Brown had Peppers playing it. What Hudson isn't doing is lining up as a weak side or strong side LB. Peppers did that.
__________________
On Harbaugh's expectations for M football in 2015 (NFL NETWORK): “We'd rather be about it than talk about it."
Jeff Buchanan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 17th, 2017, 11:18 AM   #13
Hannibal
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 7,418
I lost track of the number of plays where a QB got pressured by an unblocked LB who came screaming in like a cruise missile where I immediately thought to myself "A dual threat QB probably dodges that guy and scrambles for a first down." Instead, our QBs often chucked it into coverage. That's the disadvantage that we are in at least until McCaffrey is up to speed.

Not surprised to see no progress from Speight. He is a MAC caliber talent who has gotten great coaching and is now at his hard ceiling. I have a lot of appreciation for the intangibles that he brings to the table but we're not going to prosper with a "game manager" this year. With our shaky OL this would be a great year to have a quick and athletic guy who can dodge traffic.

Last edited by Hannibal; April 17th, 2017 at 12:03 PM.
Hannibal is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 17th, 2017, 01:53 PM   #14
THE_WIZARD_
Senior Member
 
THE_WIZARD_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,144
Did you guys win? Or did the fuckin' refs screw you again...
THE_WIZARD_ is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 17th, 2017, 02:28 PM   #15
WM Wolverine
Senior Member
 
WM Wolverine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Michigan
Posts: 8,556
We had pop Warner referees yet they officiated the game better than that game we played in the Alamo Bowl.
WM Wolverine is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 18th, 2017, 11:50 AM   #16
Rocky Bleier
Senior Member
 
Rocky Bleier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Northwest, WI
Posts: 9,195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal View Post
Not surprised to see no progress from Speight. He is a MAC caliber talent who has gotten great coaching and is now at his hard ceiling. I have a lot of appreciation for the intangibles that he brings to the table but we're not going to prosper with a "game manager" this year. With our shaky OL this would be a great year to have a quick and athletic guy who can dodge traffic.
My biggest complaint is the bad decisions he makes under pressure. I don't trust him in big games. I'll wager he plays like shit at Penn State, especially if it's a night game.
__________________
I'll let you ban hate speech when you let me define hate speech.
Rocky Bleier is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 18th, 2017, 01:54 PM   #17
Rocky Bleier
Senior Member
 
Rocky Bleier's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Northwest, WI
Posts: 9,195
And it's official. UM @ PSU is a night game. Speight will throw a minimum of 2 INTs and probably fumble once while being sacked. Good game to wager on. Major payback for last year's beat down in Ann Arbor.

https://twitter.com/PennStateFball/s...7Ctwgr%5Etweet
__________________
I'll let you ban hate speech when you let me define hate speech.

Last edited by Rocky Bleier; April 18th, 2017 at 01:58 PM.
Rocky Bleier is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 18th, 2017, 02:24 PM   #18
Wild Hoss
Senior Member
 
Wild Hoss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,120
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE_WIZARD_ View Post
Did you guys win? Or did the fuckin' refs screw you again...
fuckin refs
Wild Hoss is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 18th, 2017, 02:56 PM   #19
Jeff Buchanan
Senior Member
 
Jeff Buchanan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,416
If you like serious looks at the run game, this is for you. It's every running play B2B. A couple thoughts:

If I'm seeing it correctly, the biggest runs - and there were a lot of them - came when the OL was working against mostly the 2's on D. There wasn't a lot of rotation on the OL. Runyan played at RT because JBB was reportedly held out due to minor injury. Execution in the run game was significantly improved from 2016. Frey effect.

When you watch just the run plays, it's instructive. I saw plays run that were actually decent constraints to the McDoom sweeps, Power and RO. The D was getting sucked in big time; to my eye, constraints were rare in 2016 and if they were run execution was awful. That hurt the run game. The 2s getting trucked are probably representative of players on the defenses in the lower and mid tiers of the BIG. There should be no post game hand wringing over losses that M should never have to these teams if the run game actually shows out like this in the 2017 season.

Some of the young guys at RB are pretty damn good. I don't think there is any question that Evans is the starter and Deveon's hier apparent. Just like Smith last spring, Evans had just a couple of carries and then didn't play.

O'Korn ran a shit ton of RO and was damn good at it. He did take a huge hit trying to get across the goal line but shook it off. Peters runs play action to the run game well beyond his years and experience.

After watching just the run game, Peters and O'Korn bring another dimension to the offense that Speight just does not have. Their legs and quickness. Speight's PA game is worse than Peter's, no better than O'Korns. Just don't let O'Korn try to make big plays with his arm off the PA. Those are going to be high risk low return unless he has improved dramatically in that part of his game. I didn't see it.

If I'm Harbaugh, I'm dealing with a conundrum regarding my QBs. It's not a controversy. The right guy is going to start and there's going to be no guarantee that starter will finish the game unless he has a hot hand. I can see a quick hook for any starter if the offense isn't moving the chains and no hesitation whatsoever to put another QB in and then run plays that optimize that QBs skill set. Each of them is different in that way. Not a bad thing to have.

The run game is likely to suck with Wilton at QB; much more variable with either Peter's or O'Korn back there and it was obvious in the spring game tape overall. Maybe Wilton is a lot better in the pass game and command of the offense than he looked but what we saw cannot be encouraging.

__________________
On Harbaugh's expectations for M football in 2015 (NFL NETWORK): “We'd rather be about it than talk about it."

Last edited by Jeff Buchanan; April 18th, 2017 at 02:58 PM.
Jeff Buchanan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old April 18th, 2017, 04:22 PM   #20
SeattleLionsFan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 22,475
Has Harbaugh ever had a quick hook for his QBs?
__________________
To be a professional means that you don't die. - Takeru "the Tsunami" Kobayashi
SeattleLionsFan is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
All logos and trademarks in this site are property of their respective owners. The comments are property of their posters, all the rest © DetroitLionsForum.com.
This site is a non-profit fan site and IS NOT affiliated with the NFL or Detroit Lions or any other sports team. Please visit the official site of the Detroit Lions for official information on the Lions.